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 Free Kanter

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Professo_Sloan
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PostSubject: Re: Free Kanter   Thu Jan 03, 2013 10:55 pm

TheMagnus wrote:
I kind of half agree with you, and half not.

I mean, I definitely see where you are coming from, with Mo's injury you have written off your hopes for this season and are pinning your hopes on the future, so from that perspective what you are saying makes sense...sort of.

I love what I am seeing from both Kanter and Favors right now, love it. They are both playing with confidence and energy and (most importantly) attitude. Kanter looks like he is getting back to being Big Turkey and enjoying the game.

Here's the thing about Kanter though, dude has a big old type A personality with natural confidence (as you said), and I actually think what is happening now is the best thing for him. The guys that are playing in front of him are better than he is right now, that is a fact, and I think the worst thing you can do for a guy like Kanter is hand him something just because you (or he) thinks he should be entitled to it. Make him work for it it, make him struggle, make him learn how to do his best in a limited role before you hand him the reins and let him take over. I don't think the situation this year stunts his growth at all, if anything having guys like Jefferson and Millsap (especially Jefferson) around has been great for him. He's only 20 years old, he's getting quality minutes in pretty much every game,

Not to mention injury risk. This team is miles and miles away from unleashing the beast. Let the kid grow for hells sake.


TheMagnus wrote:
his offense is being mentored by one of the best post scorers in the NBA, so I just don't see how changing that so he can play more minutes helps him or the Jazz now or in the future.

Whoa whoa there. We ain't talking about Karl Malone, Duncan, Shaq, or Hakeem here. Jefferson pseudo training could do more harm than good.

zero24gravity wrote:

That "attitude" is the thing I have started to notice lately. Both Favors & Kanter have been getting in people's faces & getting a little "nasty" lately. I love that. Not "dirty", just "tough". Being at the game live yesterday gave me an even better understanding of their new found attitudes (especially Enes). I don't think the camera catches all the little chest bumps, stare downs, shoulder blocks, etc that those guys are putting on opposing players. The Wolves bigs, even Love & Pecovic who are both big dudes, were getting very frusterated with the phsyical play.


Big difference between Kanter's attitude and Favors' attitude, son. Kanter is a natural, as your leader poster fellow was getting at. Favors might have it inside him as well, and no doubt I see what you see, but he is nowhere near natural confidence. This boy, nay man, has to earn his confidence from within. He's clearly a timid fellow, leery of his surrounds, calculating, searching...... don't take this as a knock on Favors in the least, but he is who he is. The abilities and their growth in Favors will bring him the comfort he covets and then is when we say WATCH THE **** OUT!

That's how his personality type works.
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PostSubject: Re: Free Kanter   Thu Jan 03, 2013 11:11 pm

Mutangclan wrote:
TheMagnus wrote:


I think we agree on most of this, I was simply pointing out the double standard, not saying that your points don't apply to Millsap or that you were wrong. In fact that was the first thing I said. And if I'm giving Millsap a pass it has to be less generous than the one you are giving Jefferson.

The fantasy rankings have no bearing on my points because they are obviously heavily biased towards minutes. I was recently offered to trade Gasol (mine) for Millsap, if those two were playing the same minutes I would have taken the deal in a heartbeat, but Corbin keeps cutting Millsap's minutes so I couldn't take it.

My point about perception and reality was simply this...

Perception: Al is just what he is and produces the same almost regardless of anything else.

Reality: Al suffers from wider swings in effort and usefulness than Millsap, and more than almost any other player on the Jazz.

Perception: Millsap is in a "slump", or there is something wrong with him.

Reality: Nothing is wrong with Millsap, he's still producing the same as he always has, his box scores aren't as good simply because he is playing less.

So whatever you want to say about his attitude or his body language, the fact is that his production per minute has not seen a noticeable decrease, if anything it has improved. What makes it truly ridiculous is that he really has been the best player on the team, again, for the third year in a row, and while other guys like Foye and Jefferson can half-ass it all they want and not see their time cut, he is getting his minutes cut more and more every time he misses a couple shots. So it doesn't really surprise me at all that he would be pissed about what is going on right now.

But thats the thing, I'm not giving Al a pass. I just know what to expect, or better yet NOT to expect from him. So what is the reality on Al? No matter how much effort he puts in, he's still Al Jefferson who at his peak, is a double double, 1.5 blks a game, and does NOTHING to help his team win. So in a round about way, we agree. I'm just saying with him, unlike Paul, if his effort isn't there, he still is just Al, who never helps his team win anyway outside of post scoring.
But when Paul is off, he affects the whole team because he does so much and is such a good player.

On Paul, if his stats are the same per 30mins or whatever, then you win that one. Maybe it is just his pissed off-ness about not playing.

But we have NO argument, in that Corbin is screwing all this up. Paul/Fav/Kanter need more minutes, and a big start to that is playing Al less.

Mu, if we were a completely crappy team we would have free license to play Kanter and Fav (not the Millman or Big Al) in the hopes of developing our team moreso than being exciting on any given night. As it is, we're part of the most interesting aspect of this year's NBA season: The West, and who's going to win it. As I said in an earlier post, the NBA does not want to see player development in actual NBA games. They want to see the best against the best (or, those that are perceived as the best against those that are perceived as the best).

I think the Jazz, in some ways, are a victim of our own success. We are a completely legitimate team in the NBA, without ever winning a championship. But, I don't think the NBA wants to promote NBA games by running advertisements like, "See how the Jazz develop Enes Kanter, Alec Burkes, and Demarcus Carroll in an attempt to defeat the LA Lakers who are trying to find chemistry between Steve Nash, Kobe Bryant, Metta World Peace, Pao Gasol, and Dwight Howard." When the NBA promotes games it's more like: "See Kobe and the Lakers against Double-double threat Al Jefferson and the pesky Jazz."

As a small market team, we have to decide which direction we head. Really, there's only one other small market team I think is worth following: San Antonio. I don't have the answers. We don't have a rookie Tim Duncan. What can we do? I vote for developing our young talent-- but that is going to put the Jazz in a serious hole for a few years. Playing Kanter over Big Al might help the Jazz as far as long term development-- but, is that what we want, or, is that what the NBA wants?
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PostSubject: Re: Free Kanter   Fri Jan 04, 2013 10:32 am

Professo_Sloan wrote:

Big difference between Kanter's attitude and Favors' attitude, son. Kanter is a natural, as your leader poster fellow was getting at. Favors might have it inside him as well, and no doubt I see what you see, but he is nowhere near natural confidence. This boy, nay man, has to earn his confidence from within. He's clearly a timid fellow, leery of his surrounds, calculating, searching...... don't take this as a knock on Favors in the least, but he is who he is. The abilities and their growth in Favors will bring him the comfort he covets and then is when we say WATCH THE **** OUT!

That's how his personality type works.

Agreed. Smile

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PostSubject: Re: Free Kanter   Fri Jan 04, 2013 12:19 pm

zero24gravity wrote:
Professo_Sloan wrote:

Big difference between Kanter's attitude and Favors' attitude, son. Kanter is a natural, as your leader poster fellow was getting at. Favors might have it inside him as well, and no doubt I see what you see, but he is nowhere near natural confidence. This boy, nay man, has to earn his confidence from within. He's clearly a timid fellow, leery of his surrounds, calculating, searching...... don't take this as a knock on Favors in the least, but he is who he is. The abilities and their growth in Favors will bring him the comfort he covets and then is when we say WATCH THE **** OUT!

That's how his personality type works.

Agreed. Smile


If San Antonio is the team that you want the Jazz to look to then you have to realize that they went through losing season's and flat out tanked games to get the top pick in the draft 2 different times more or less. The same thing with OKC they both had to be really bad at one time to get top pick's in the draft and that's how they built their teams, the Jazz are trying to do it and win at the same time pretty dam hard to do for a small market team.

Favors is coming around maybe bring him along slowly was the right thing for the Jazz to do, big Al is taken these kid's under his arm's and showing them moves that are going to make them better players no question's about it and I see Favors growing because of it and see him become a very good player for the Jazz sooner rather than later.
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PostSubject: Re: Free Kanter   Fri Jan 04, 2013 12:29 pm

dongibby wrote:
zero24gravity wrote:
Professo_Sloan wrote:

Big difference between Kanter's attitude and Favors' attitude, son. Kanter is a natural, as your leader poster fellow was getting at. Favors might have it inside him as well, and no doubt I see what you see, but he is nowhere near natural confidence. This boy, nay man, has to earn his confidence from within. He's clearly a timid fellow, leery of his surrounds, calculating, searching...... don't take this as a knock on Favors in the least, but he is who he is. The abilities and their growth in Favors will bring him the comfort he covets and then is when we say WATCH THE **** OUT!

That's how his personality type works.

Agreed. Smile


If San Antonio is the team that you want the Jazz to look to then you have to realize that they went through losing season's and flat out tanked games to get the top pick in the draft 2 different times more or less. The same thing with OKC they both had to be really bad at one time to get top pick's in the draft and that's how they built their teams, the Jazz are trying to do it and win at the same time pretty dam hard to do for a small market team.


That is true. And while the Jazz haven't had the #1 pick (Duncan) or the #2 pick (Durant), they do currently have two #3 overall picks. Tanking &/or being bad can work out for a team, but it can also go the route of the Clippers, where, until this year, they were REALLY bad for a LONG time despite having multiple top picks. So the Jazz have been able to get those top picks, without being really bad via trade. Just haven't got those superstars ala Duncan & Durant.
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PostSubject: Re: Free Kanter   Fri Jan 04, 2013 9:12 pm

I,m back! Thanks VOR
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PostSubject: Re: Free Kanter   Fri Jan 04, 2013 11:01 pm

zero24gravity wrote:
dongibby wrote:
zero24gravity wrote:
Professo_Sloan wrote:

Big difference between Kanter's attitude and Favors' attitude, son. Kanter is a natural, as your leader poster fellow was getting at. Favors might have it inside him as well, and no doubt I see what you see, but he is nowhere near natural confidence. This boy, nay man, has to earn his confidence from within. He's clearly a timid fellow, leery of his surrounds, calculating, searching...... don't take this as a knock on Favors in the least, but he is who he is. The abilities and their growth in Favors will bring him the comfort he covets and then is when we say WATCH THE **** OUT!

That's how his personality type works.

Agreed. Smile


If San Antonio is the team that you want the Jazz to look to then you have to realize that they went through losing season's and flat out tanked games to get the top pick in the draft 2 different times more or less. The same thing with OKC they both had to be really bad at one time to get top pick's in the draft and that's how they built their teams, the Jazz are trying to do it and win at the same time pretty dam hard to do for a small market team.


That is true. And while the Jazz haven't had the #1 pick (Duncan) or the #2 pick (Durant), they do currently have two #3 overall picks. Tanking &/or being bad can work out for a team, but it can also go the route of the Clippers, where, until this year, they were REALLY bad for a LONG time despite having multiple top picks. So the Jazz have been able to get those top picks, without being really bad via trade. Just haven't got those superstars ala Duncan & Durant.

My contention with this, SuN, is that Clippers owner (gsw, sac, was, etc.) are complete NBA dipshits who believe their outer luccess auto transfers to everything. Clippers had some good teams with crap management. Jazz aren't in that spot and can overcome a tank* just as San antone did.

*I don't condone intentional tanking. Chess subtracting assets for higher draft picks is what I'm all about. Never lose on purpose though.
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PostSubject: Re: Free Kanter   Tue Mar 12, 2013 9:09 pm

TheMagnus wrote:
Mutangclan wrote:

Its because I think everyone knows what Al is. He's a post scorer and thats it. And as long as he's doing his post-scoring, then he's still the same ole same ole. As for sucking, Al's been 17 and 9 the last two weeks, so for him, thats not sucking, but standard Al. But when Paul isn't getting the rebs, steals, putbacks or doing the hustle things he's known for doing, he seems "off". Which he has been. I think thats why Corbin has been sitting him, because Paul doesn't seem much into it. (I've wondered if Paul heard something about being traded...) Not saying that was the correct decision, but nonetheless. Paul wouldn't be sitting so much, if Al sat more, which is the better decision.

I dont know about Kanter v Fav. One is turning it over twice a game, and one 1.5 a game. I agree on Fav at Center, but I think any combination of Fav/Kanter/Paul is fine. And I'd like to see more Paul/Kanter lineups.

Ya, you are getting to the main point of my argument there. What we are talking about here is perception vs. reality, because what you are saying is the perception, and what I'm telling you is reality.

Sure Jefferson has been solid the last two weeks, two weeks were the Jazz played 4 games total. The two weeks before that Jefferson was awful in 6 of the Jazz 8 games, he looked completely disinterested and tired, he shot the ball terribly adn the only player to have a worse on/off rating ove rthe last 15 games was Randy Foye, nobody. Jefferson was by far and away the worst in both on/off and +/-.

But Jefferson has continued to play 30+ minutes in every game but one, unlike Millsap, who has only seen 30+ minutes in 1 of the Jazz last 10 games.

So let's solve this mystery.... Millsaps per game numbers are falling, what could be the cause? Is it effort? Is he mad about something? It couldn't be the fact that he's averaging fewer minutes, could it?

Millsaps per minute production hasn't changed, his shooting has actually been better than it was at the beginning of the season, and he's still rebounding blocking shots and getting steals, but Millsap is getting 26 minutes a game over the last 10, instead of the 32 minutes he was playing before. The Jazz record in those games? 3-7.

Interesting stat of the day, the Jazz are 9-7 when Millsap plays more than 30 minutes, and 7-10 when he doesn't.

And there you have reasons #2 and #3 why I have lost faith in Ty Corbin.


Dang Mag! Just found this accidentally...... And you were giving me grief for saying Fire Corbin.....this was Jan 3rd!!
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PostSubject: Re: Free Kanter   Wed Mar 13, 2013 7:48 am

Mutangclan wrote:
TheMagnus wrote:
Mutangclan wrote:

Its because I think everyone knows what Al is. He's a post scorer and thats it. And as long as he's doing his post-scoring, then he's still the same ole same ole. As for sucking, Al's been 17 and 9 the last two weeks, so for him, thats not sucking, but standard Al. But when Paul isn't getting the rebs, steals, putbacks or doing the hustle things he's known for doing, he seems "off". Which he has been. I think thats why Corbin has been sitting him, because Paul doesn't seem much into it. (I've wondered if Paul heard something about being traded...) Not saying that was the correct decision, but nonetheless. Paul wouldn't be sitting so much, if Al sat more, which is the better decision.

I dont know about Kanter v Fav. One is turning it over twice a game, and one 1.5 a game. I agree on Fav at Center, but I think any combination of Fav/Kanter/Paul is fine. And I'd like to see more Paul/Kanter lineups.

Ya, you are getting to the main point of my argument there. What we are talking about here is perception vs. reality, because what you are saying is the perception, and what I'm telling you is reality.

Sure Jefferson has been solid the last two weeks, two weeks were the Jazz played 4 games total. The two weeks before that Jefferson was awful in 6 of the Jazz 8 games, he looked completely disinterested and tired, he shot the ball terribly adn the only player to have a worse on/off rating ove rthe last 15 games was Randy Foye, nobody. Jefferson was by far and away the worst in both on/off and +/-.

But Jefferson has continued to play 30+ minutes in every game but one, unlike Millsap, who has only seen 30+ minutes in 1 of the Jazz last 10 games.

So let's solve this mystery.... Millsaps per game numbers are falling, what could be the cause? Is it effort? Is he mad about something? It couldn't be the fact that he's averaging fewer minutes, could it?

Millsaps per minute production hasn't changed, his shooting has actually been better than it was at the beginning of the season, and he's still rebounding blocking shots and getting steals, but Millsap is getting 26 minutes a game over the last 10, instead of the 32 minutes he was playing before. The Jazz record in those games? 3-7.

Interesting stat of the day, the Jazz are 9-7 when Millsap plays more than 30 minutes, and 7-10 when he doesn't.

And there you have reasons #2 and #3 why I have lost faith in Ty Corbin.


Dang Mag! Just found this accidentally...... And you were giving me grief for saying Fire Corbin.....this was Jan 3rd!!

Well, like I said in another thread, I've felt the same way about Corbin for most of the season. I just felt like a lot of the reasons the fire Corbin drum beat reached a fever pitch recently weren't really any different than what he's been doing all along, and I also think that the impact of his bad coaching on the season as a whole hasn't been as large as people seem to think it has. I don't think he's lost the team, and I don't think we'd be a huge number of games better on the season if he were better, I just don't think he's a very good coach.
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PostSubject: Re: Free Kanter   Wed Mar 13, 2013 8:54 am

[quote="TheMagnus"][quote="Mutangclan"]
TheMagnus wrote:
Mutangclan wrote:
TheMagnus wrote:


And there you have reasons #2 and #3 why I have lost faith in Ty Corbin.


Dang Mag! Just found this accidentally...... And you were giving me grief for saying Fire Corbin.....this was Jan 3rd!!

Well, like I said in another thread, I've felt the same way about Corbin for most of the season. I just felt like a lot of the reasons the fire Corbin drum beat reached a fever pitch recently weren't really any different than what he's been doing all along, and I also think that the impact of his bad coaching on the season as a whole hasn't been as large as people seem to think it has. I don't think he's lost the team, and I don't think we'd be a huge number of games better on the season if he were better, I just don't think he's a very good coach.

So what do you think, Fire Corbin? Go after JVG, SVG, McMillian, other, Jerry???
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PostSubject: Re: Free Kanter   Wed Mar 13, 2013 10:19 am

Mutangclan wrote:

So what do you think, Fire Corbin? Go after JVG, SVG, McMillian, other, Jerry???

I think they should probably fire Corbin this summer, but I doubt they will.

As far as a replacement goes...I actually don't love any of those options. I love Jerry but I don't think they should being him back, and the rest are all good coaches, but they all have their own identity and style, and I would prefer that the Jazz find some younger up an comming coach that mixes an appreciation for Jazz tradition with a knowlege of both traditional and modern data based coaching methods. Somebody that can come in and create an identity wiht the Jazz franchise the way that both Frank Layden and Jerry Sloan did.

JVG and McMillan are both grind it out "east-coast" style coaches. They consistently played at some of the slowest paces in the NBA, interestingly they used that pace in entirely differnet ways. McMillan using it to create a highly efficient offense based on methodical ball movement and JVG using it to facilitate hard nosed position based defense. Stan is a little harder to guage, he's had some really great teams, and he was essentially forced out of a championship calliber squad so Pat Riley could get another ring, he's also quite the charachter.

I don't know, but one thing I do know is that between Lindsey and KOC they have been around two of the all time great NBA coaches for a lot of years, two coaches that have VERY different styles, almost opposite in many ways. Jerry was great because of his consistency, every player know what their role was, every scheme and every set was disciplined and that discipline let to efficiency, I also think he was under-rated when it came to making minor adjustments to his schemes to fit the personel he had. Pop is one of the greatest tactical coaches in the history of the game, his gift is being able to adjust his schemes to his personel AND to what his opponents are doing, both on macro and micro levels.

I think they have to see that Ty is simply not that calliber of coach, and while it seems like an obvious point to mention that few are, I would think that you have to take a similar approach to coaches as you do to franchise type players. You can live with a few rough years if the player is young and the potential is good, but as soon as you know about where the cieling is, and that isn't very high, then it's probably time to move on.
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PostSubject: Re: Free Kanter   Wed Mar 13, 2013 11:24 am

Well, whether Corbin or a new guy, job number 1 is to Free Kanter!

Dude has been insane in 6 games in March: 15.5 ppg, 9.5 rbs on 0.683 shooting
Dude has been super solid post-Allstar break: 11.9 ppg, 7 RB, 0.607 shooting

That is better than Sap, better than Al and way better than Favors. Anytime Al or Sap can't go, time to slip Enes into the starting line-up!

Oh yeah, and Free Evans. The jump shot looks for real.

I'm going to guess that fairly shortly here Corbin is going to start tightening up the rotation strictly because that is dogma. I'm gonna be pissed if Evans heads back to DNP's and Kanter's minutes get reduced.
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PostSubject: Re: Free Kanter   Wed Mar 13, 2013 11:28 am

TheMagnus wrote:


I think they have to see that Ty is simply not that calliber of coach, and while it seems like an obvious point to mention that few are, I would think that you have to take a similar approach to coaches as you do to franchise type players. You can live with a few rough years if the player is young and the potential is good, but as soon as you know about where the cieling is, and that isn't very high, then it's probably time to move on.

Great post Magnus, and I agree unfortunately, I dont think they'll fire him after this season either. But should. I think all I'd really want is someone that runs an offense that does utilize ball movement and the athleticism we have. And just as important I hope they hire someone that either has been a headcoach already somewhere, or at least as been a right hand man. None of this moving from basically player development to the head position.

That is the one comforting fan thing, that KOC and now Lindsey have some serious experience being around the best head coaches. I imagine they'll make a smart move, just hopefully sooner than later.
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PostSubject: Re: Free Kanter   Wed Mar 13, 2013 11:45 am

If the Jazz are truly prepared to be a lottery team next year that would suggest to me that the team is looking to peak out in 3 years with this cohort. Corbin is not the man for the job so it would make the most sense to shift horses before the draft. Look no further than Denver and George Karl as an example of a coach who has mastered spreading minutes around a 10-man deep roster, with no superstars, who is going to be dangerous in the playoffs. Corbin is an unimaginative mechanical coach - the Jazz need a guy to start over with the whole offense and defensive scheme to match the talents at hand. A big start in this direction is letting Al go and getting a creative and fast PG on board.
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PostSubject: Re: Free Kanter   Wed Mar 13, 2013 12:23 pm

Guys, I moved all of this coaching talk over to the "FIRE TYRONE CORBIN" thread, it's kind of off topic here...


Last edited by TheMagnus on Wed Mar 13, 2013 12:43 pm; edited 1 time in total
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PostSubject: Re: Free Kanter   Wed Mar 13, 2013 12:42 pm

MTJazz wrote:
Well, whether Corbin or a new guy, job number 1 is to Free Kanter!

Dude has been insane in 6 games in March: 15.5 ppg, 9.5 rbs on 0.683 shooting
Dude has been super solid post-Allstar break: 11.9 ppg, 7 RB, 0.607 shooting

That is better than Sap, better than Al and way better than Favors. Anytime Al or Sap can't go, time to slip Enes into the starting line-up!

Oh yeah, and Free Evans. The jump shot looks for real.

I'm going to guess that fairly shortly here Corbin is going to start tightening up the rotation strictly because that is dogma. I'm gonna be pissed if Evans heads back to DNP's and Kanter's minutes get reduced.

I second that motion, would really like to see Kanter maintain at least 20 minutes a game, wish those minutes would come at the expense of Al Jefferson.

Evans is tough, with the other 4 all healthy I don't see how he play's at all. That's not on Corbin, he's just got 4 really good players in front of him. On top of that I think Corbin is looking for some minutes for Marvin, and he's played better at PF than he has at SF, so if any PF minutes do come available he's in line there too.

My hope for Evans is that he gets his shot next year as the 4th guy in the big man rotation.
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PostSubject: Re: Free Kanter   Wed Mar 13, 2013 12:58 pm

TheMagnus wrote:
MTJazz wrote:
Well, whether Corbin or a new guy, job number 1 is to Free Kanter!

Dude has been insane in 6 games in March: 15.5 ppg, 9.5 rbs on 0.683 shooting
Dude has been super solid post-Allstar break: 11.9 ppg, 7 RB, 0.607 shooting

That is better than Sap, better than Al and way better than Favors. Anytime Al or Sap can't go, time to slip Enes into the starting line-up!

Oh yeah, and Free Evans. The jump shot looks for real.

I'm going to guess that fairly shortly here Corbin is going to start tightening up the rotation strictly because that is dogma. I'm gonna be pissed if Evans heads back to DNP's and Kanter's minutes get reduced.

I second that motion, would really like to see Kanter maintain at least 20 minutes a game, wish those minutes would come at the expense of Al Jefferson.

Evans is tough, with the other 4 all healthy I don't see how he play's at all. That's not on Corbin, he's just got 4 really good players in front of him. On top of that I think Corbin is looking for some minutes for Marvin, and he's played better at PF than he has at SF, so if any PF minutes do come available he's in line there too.

My hope for Evans is that he gets his shot next year as the 4th guy in the big man rotation.

Interesing that you mention Evans & Marvin competing for time, because I think that the best time to have Evans in the game is when Marvin is also in there. Marvin can be a good rebounding SF/PF & gets more respect as a shooter than Evans, and both guys can guard the PF/SF types. Since Marv is a "big" SF and Jeremy is a small PF, playing together helps cover up some of the weaknesses. Evans isn't going to be effective against all PF's, but when the other team rolls out a guy like Villanueva, who isn't an inside player, Jeremy can use his athletisism to his advantage without any threat of being exposed by his lack of bulk inside. I doubt he ever becomes a starter/20+ minute guy, but he has plenty of ability to be a strong bench/role player, if played in the right situations.

Oh, and to go back on topic .... yes, free Kanter at the expense of Al's minutes. I love that Enes has shown so much improvement. Last year he wouldn't even look at the basket from more than 8 feet away, this year he is shooting face up J's with confidence. Last year he was obviously not in great shape, this year he looks like world class athlete. Last year & most of this year he would not keep the ball up high, constantly bring the ball down low after a rebound & often times getting stripped. Now he is keeping that ball up on his fingertips & making great put-back shots after all those offensive boards. .... now, if only he'd pass out of the post & not force so many shots. Smile
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PostSubject: Re: Free Kanter   Wed Mar 13, 2013 2:29 pm

Sadly, I see it unlikely Corbin diminishes Al's minutes...until it becomes clear that the Jazz won't make the playoffs. Corbin just isn't the type of coach to sit a guy who some nights can't hit the broad side of a barn...if he is a veteran of Al's stature. Again, until the Jazz are mathematically eliminated, I don't think we'll see a whole lot different. Ty is gonna ride Al into the sunset this season. And for all that goes, I wouldn't mind Paul sitting more when he is having one of his funky slump games or series of games. It is arguable right now that Kanter is playing the best ball of all our bigs right now and should therefore be logging the most minutes per game of all of them. Tell me how come I'm wrong with that assessment....
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PostSubject: Re: Free Kanter   Wed Mar 13, 2013 2:43 pm

MTJazz wrote:
Sadly, I see it unlikely Corbin diminishes Al's minutes...until it becomes clear that the Jazz won't make the playoffs. Corbin just isn't the type of coach to sit a guy who some nights can't hit the broad side of a barn...if he is a veteran of Al's stature. Again, until the Jazz are mathematically eliminated, I don't think we'll see a whole lot different. Ty is gonna ride Al into the sunset this season. And for all that goes, I wouldn't mind Paul sitting more when he is having one of his funky slump games or series of games. It is arguable right now that Kanter is playing the best ball of all our bigs right now and should therefore be logging the most minutes per game of all of them. Tell me how come I'm wrong with that assessment....

I think you are right. I will say that corbin has already proved that he is willing to cut down Millsaps minutes, but not Jeffersons. That was the topic of my previous rant on this thread back in january.
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PostSubject: Re: Free Kanter   Wed Mar 13, 2013 10:36 pm

TheMagnus wrote:
MTJazz wrote:
Sadly, I see it unlikely Corbin diminishes Al's minutes...until it becomes clear that the Jazz won't make the playoffs. Corbin just isn't the type of coach to sit a guy who some nights can't hit the broad side of a barn...if he is a veteran of Al's stature. Again, until the Jazz are mathematically eliminated, I don't think we'll see a whole lot different. Ty is gonna ride Al into the sunset this season. And for all that goes, I wouldn't mind Paul sitting more when he is having one of his funky slump games or series of games. It is arguable right now that Kanter is playing the best ball of all our bigs right now and should therefore be logging the most minutes per game of all of them. Tell me how come I'm wrong with that assessment....

I think you are right. I will say that corbin has already proved that he is willing to cut down Millsaps minutes, but not Jeffersons. That was the topic of my previous rant on this thread back in january.

C.O.Y.
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PostSubject: Re: Free Kanter   Wed Mar 13, 2013 11:01 pm

I want to see some dam fire coming out of the coach when players look good or like crap! Or REFS! cheers
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PostSubject: Re: Free Kanter   Thu Mar 14, 2013 9:43 am

Kanter is showing a complete game. Offense/defense, hustle, toughness, energy, rebounding. Guy is a STUD.
Can't wait for next year, when he Fav and Paul all get 25+ most likely.
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PostSubject: Re: Free Kanter   Thu Mar 14, 2013 6:41 pm

Sorry Mut... Paul won't be with the Jazz next season.
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PostSubject: Re: Free Kanter   Thu Mar 14, 2013 7:47 pm

outerspacefan wrote:
Sorry Mut... Paul won't be with the Jazz next season.

While I give the odds at 50:50, why do you think otherwise? I think Paul would be happy to play with the Jazz until retirement IF he doesn't get interest from either an obvious upper echelon contending now team or sick money that simply can't be refused for a basement dweller. League economics are changing quickly, mad money won't fly as fast as days previous. I think if the Jazz offered him a competitive though non-insane salary he would bite; the club has potential to make some noise in the next 3 years with some smart pick-ups and young core. Paul is "under-rated", this late in his career, and he hasn't exactly made that "appropriately rated" with his play this year, no one is going to see him as a franchise build-around player. He is an awesome complimentary piece, not the #1 guy, but high quality second/third option.
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PostSubject: Re: Free Kanter   Thu Mar 14, 2013 8:05 pm

MTJazz wrote:
outerspacefan wrote:
Sorry Mut... Paul won't be with the Jazz next season.

While I give the odds at 50:50, why do you think otherwise? I think Paul would be happy to play with the Jazz until retirement IF he doesn't get interest from either an obvious upper echelon contending now team or sick money that simply can't be refused for a basement dweller. League economics are changing quickly, mad money won't fly as fast as days previous. I think if the Jazz offered him a competitive though non-insane salary he would bite; the club has potential to make some noise in the next 3 years with some smart pick-ups and young core. Paul is "under-rated", this late in his career, and he hasn't exactly made that "appropriately rated" with his play this year, no one is going to see him as a franchise build-around player. He is an awesome complimentary piece, not the #1 guy, but high quality second/third option.

Agree with all of that.

I look at him in a similar role to David West with the Pacers if the Jazz keep him going forward. He and West are almost the same player only West is 4 years older. West is arguably the Pacers best all around player this season but he really flies under the radar, just quietly doing what he does and doing it damn well. That is exactly what Millsap does, and while I acknowledge that he may not be back next year, I really really hope he is, and that he stays a Jazz man his whole career.
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