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 DC Deserves His Own Thread

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zero24gravity
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PostSubject: Re: DC Deserves His Own Thread   Mon Mar 18, 2013 2:18 pm

Hadn't seen that read from Locke.

Funny thing is, I seem to recall Ty himself saying that he likes Alec & Foye together (don't ask me to cite that). So if he likes them together, and the numbers support them playing together, then why... WHY, does he start Foye (not with Burks) and also chooses to play Watson as back-up PG instead Burks, meaning that Alec is getting his minutes next to Earl (not Foye), which also means there aren't #2PG minutes for Burks to play next to Foye?

The whole TyCo world is nutzz.
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PostSubject: Re: DC Deserves His Own Thread   Mon Mar 18, 2013 3:48 pm

TheMagnus wrote:
zero24gravity wrote:
I'm not against GH starting, but like most of you, I don't get why Foye is keeping the job, while DC gets a DNP.

I just read this comment made by TyCo...

Gordon Hayward started for the first time since Nov. 16; coach Tyrone Corbin inserted him into the first group in place of DeMarre Carroll. Corbin said he made the move "because of the results we’ve been getting of late."


Sorry Ty, but if you were worried about the "results" the team has been getting lately, you wouldn't be keeping Foye in & leaving DC out. It just doesn't make sense. I don't hate Foye, he's a good role player, but what in the world is he doing to keep getting the starts? Just name me one thing... PLEASE.

Did you see this from David Locke....

David Locke wrote:

INSIDER – Are Foye’s struggles related to who plays the point?

Randy Foye has been struggling to make shots since the All-Star break. Numerous factors have gone into Foye shooting woes. Prior to the Minnesota game he took a shot to the leg and willed his way through that game and his legs have struggled to return to him.

In addition the Jazz have been swinging between 4 different point guards and that has made it difficult for Foye. Each of these point guards play the game very differently and for a shooter that is a considerable adjustment to how and where they are going to get the shots.

....

Here are the numbers for Randy Foye depending who his point guard has been:

Foye with Mo Williams – 37% and 36% from 3 – 1.4 FTA per 36 – Mo off – 40% and 42% 3.0 FTA per 36

Foye with Jamaal Tinsley – 43% and 46% from 3- 2.7 FTA per 36 – JT off – 36% and 36% 2.4 per 36

Foye with Earl Watson – 35% and 36% from 3 3.2 FTA per 36 – EW off – 40% and 41% 2.4 per 36

Foye with Alec Burks – 39% and 42% from 3 4.1 FTA per 36 – off the floor – 39% and 40% 2.3 per 36

http://weareutahjazz.com/lockedonjazz/


How many really good reasons do you think Corbin needs before he makes a change? Perhaps the quality of the "reasons" is irrelevant, maybe he just needs the Jazz to lose a whole bunch more before he's willing to ask the right questions and get the right answers.

Foye + Starting = Wrong
Anybody + Earl Watson = Wrong
Foye + Tinsley = Better

Foye + Burks = THE RIGHT THING TO DO!


I like the fact that TyCo is giving thought to the interconnected, multivariate effects players have on the guys they play with.

I DON'T like the fact that he gets it wrong most of the time!

I mean, sure, he's thinking about it, but it's some kind of "gut feeling", "seat o' the pants" non-analysis. He's forming impressions when he should be crunching some actual numbers once in a while.

He also seems to make his mind up about things and fails to adjust when the results don't support his early conclusion. Especially the results of the player combinations he favors. He also draws wrong conclusions-as, for instance, why we HAVE to have Jefferson on the floor at the end of games. "Well, he's the only reliable scoring option we have." would be TyCo's defense of that "thinking", but maybe the "proven" ineffectiveness of the other guys in those situations has to do with Al's presence too?

So I'm starting to think TyCo's coaching is "o-KAY"...in a role where okay doesn't really cut it. His analysis stops a level short of being adequate and a couple of levels short of giving the Jazz an advantage.

Can he get better? Maybe. And, *sigh*, I'm resigned to the fact that the Jazz are going to give him another year to do so. Or not.
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PostSubject: Re: DC Deserves His Own Thread   Tue Mar 19, 2013 3:02 pm

the most amazing thing about Ty is how wrong he can consistently be when he even says the right things. I mean the dude even EVENTUALLY identifies the issue......and then shits the bed on the solution...it's amazing.

Well, I've had enough of this business. I'm going to do what I can in person on Sunday. Going to be at the Dallas game, and have to try to do something. I'll be in my DC3 Tshirt. So if you boys and girls watch, look for the guy that relentlessly is trying to show Corbin (former Utah Jazz coach 2011-2013) (former Utah Jazz coach 2011-2013) * the player rotations and minutes, all while flossing his DC3 billboard shirt.

I may eventually end up kidnapping him, so watch for that too. Can't take it anymore.


*hahahahahaha, great change Moderator!!
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PostSubject: Re: DC Deserves His Own Thread   Tue Mar 19, 2013 4:55 pm

Mutangclan wrote:



*hahahahahaha, great change Moderator!!

You like that? jocolor

I'll keep cheering on the team, but I am done with TyCo (former Utah Jazz coach 2011-2013).
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PostSubject: Re: DC Deserves His Own Thread   Tue Mar 19, 2013 7:03 pm

Mutangclan wrote:
the most amazing thing about Ty is how wrong he can consistently be when he even says the right things. I mean the dude even EVENTUALLY identifies the issue......and then shits the bed on the solution...it's amazing.

That's so effin' true! Twisted Evil
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PostSubject: Re: DC Deserves His Own Thread   Thu Apr 04, 2013 11:30 am

Required reading in the DC thread http://www.sltrib.com/sltrib/blogsjazznotes/56104111-62/jazz-nuggets-carroll-sltrib.html.csp

Ummmm...we may be seeing the last of DC in a Jazz uni, so everyone please enjoy the Junkyard Dog for a couple minutes at the end of every blowout. What, like after the season he sits down with Lindsey and Lindsey says:"DC we absolutely love you, always have. Sorry about all those DNP-CDs, we had to play Marvin because otherwise we looked stupid paying him $8 million. Now, with all that behind us, Marvin only has one more year, so we'd like to lock you up on a 3-year $3 million deal. Howz that sound, buddy?"

Love this comment from a commenter on the blog:

"I really wish Carroll hadn't slept with Corbin's wife. That was a bad decision on his part--no wonder he went from starter to 13th man overnight."

Hilarious!


Last edited by MTJazz on Thu Apr 04, 2013 11:52 am; edited 1 time in total (Reason for editing : added quote)
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PostSubject: Re: DC Deserves His Own Thread   Thu Apr 04, 2013 12:52 pm

MTJazz wrote:
Required reading in the DC thread http://www.sltrib.com/sltrib/blogsjazznotes/56104111-62/jazz-nuggets-carroll-sltrib.html.csp

Ummmm...we may be seeing the last of DC in a Jazz uni, so everyone please enjoy the Junkyard Dog for a couple minutes at the end of every blowout. What, like after the season he sits down with Lindsey and Lindsey says:"DC we absolutely love you, always have. Sorry about all those DNP-CDs, we had to play Marvin because otherwise we looked stupid paying him $8 million. Now, with all that behind us, Marvin only has one more year, so we'd like to lock you up on a 3-year $3 million deal. Howz that sound, buddy?"

Love this comment from a commenter on the blog:

"I really wish Carroll hadn't slept with Corbin's wife. That was a bad decision on his part--no wonder he went from starter to 13th man overnight."

Hilarious!

Carroll will be a free agent at the end of this season, and went so far Wednedsday night as to say his relationship with fans will play a role in his decision of whether to stay or go.
"They definitely are a priority," he said. "I'll decide what I'm going to do at the end of the year. Me, man, I'm just ... at a level of my life, a level of my game, I can play in the NBA. I can be a rotation player and contribute. It's just finding the right opportunity, finding the right system, the right coach that believes."

Carroll said fans "understand what I do" and "that's why I love it here in Utah. But I just got to see when it's all said and done, see what's my best opportunity."


So, if the fan support matters a bunch to DC, then maybe we need to start a "don't go DC" petition to go along with the fire Ty.

And if Ty goes, then maybe DC would stay. This isn't the first comment he's made that talks about him not being appreciated. Is it possible Ty doesn't like these comments, and therefore benches DC? Or do the comments come from Ty benching DC for no good reason? Chicken or egg?

But I have a plan for DC that will make him a sure fire 25-30 minute a game player on the Jazz..... play about 5 more years in the league, let your skill set errode some, and play very little defense ... it's the exact formula for getting out of Ty's dog house & getting yourself into the starting line-up!
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PostSubject: Re: DC Deserves His Own Thread   Thu Apr 04, 2013 1:08 pm

zero24gravity wrote:

Carroll will be a free agent at the end of this season, and went so far Wednedsday night as to say his relationship with fans will play a role in his decision of whether to stay or go.
"They definitely are a priority," he said. "I'll decide what I'm going to do at the end of the year. Me, man, I'm just ... at a level of my life, a level of my game, I can play in the NBA. I can be a rotation player and contribute. It's just finding the right opportunity, finding the right system, the right coach that believes."

Carroll said fans "understand what I do" and "that's why I love it here in Utah. But I just got to see when it's all said and done, see what's my best opportunity."


So, if the fan support matters a bunch to DC, then maybe we need to start a "don't go DC" petition to go along with the fire Ty.

And if Ty goes, then maybe DC would stay. This isn't the first comment he's made that talks about him not being appreciated. Is it possible Ty doesn't like these comments, and therefore benches DC? Or do the comments come from Ty benching DC for no good reason? Chicken or egg?

But I have a plan for DC that will make him a sure fire 25-30 minute a game player on the Jazz..... play about 5 more years in the league, let your skill set errode some, and play very little defense ... it's the exact formula for getting out of Ty's dog house & getting yourself into the starting line-up!

Hah, man, thats exactly what I told him in Dallas as he was signing my shirt. Told him all the fans love him and know what he does despite Corbin, hes' just got to come back next year. haaaah, nice to know he listened Very Happy
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PostSubject: Re: DC Deserves His Own Thread   Thu Apr 04, 2013 1:49 pm

Mutangclan wrote:


Hah, man, thats exactly what I told him in Dallas as he was signing my shirt. Told him all the fans love him and know what he does despite Corbin, hes' just got to come back next year. haaaah, nice to know he listened Very Happy

Dude, I totally thought of your fan diplomacy when I read that quote!

But lets be honest, DC is by all accounts a super cool guy, very community oriented. This is his shout out to us, the faithful, that he heard and gives the love back. But, he also knows any other fan community is going to love his game and person as much as we do. He wants to play ball, meaningful roster minutes and there ain't no way he is going to turn down an offer from a team who insists they see lots of minutes for them on their squad. Someone once mentioned something about "hiding DC" -pure poppycock - Corbin simply does not love the Junkyard Dog and figures Marvin Freaking Williams is somehow a better go-to starter and now bench guy. And, every scouting office in the league is well aware of DC, especially the ones who watch their stats metrics. And they know Ty has rotted him on the bench and he is a FA. He is going to get decent money. Why the Jazz don't consider him as part of the Core 5 moving forward is beyond me, (except for him diddling Ty's wife, best theory out there so far). Buh-bye DC, I feel like I barely got to know ya and wishing you Matthews-like success. (Speaking of Matthews, anyone here besides me think maybe he would start over Foye? Same deal, different player. This summer better be exciting in Jazzland or I have forever lost my faith in the FO).
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PostSubject: Re: DC Deserves His Own Thread   Thu Apr 18, 2013 10:19 pm

Seriously. Could you possibly love this guy any more???? Does all the right things, says all the right things, plays his ass off.......


Get this guy a 4 year contract and be done with it:

http://www.sltrib.com/sltrib/jazz/56181712-87/jazz-carroll-param-value.html.csp
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PostSubject: Re: DC Deserves His Own Thread   Fri Apr 19, 2013 4:42 am

Mutangclan wrote:
Seriously. Could you possibly love this guy any more???? Does all the right things, says all the right things, plays his ass off.......


Get this guy a 4 year contract and be done with it:

http://www.sltrib.com/sltrib/jazz/56181712-87/jazz-carroll-param-value.html.csp

I saw that Trib piece and fell even more in purely Platonic man-love with DC. It's really incredible what a great attitude this guy has. He doesn't demand minutes (but deserves way more), isn't money grubbing and is willing to work hard, sacrifice every day and do all of the dirty work. There's no diva in this guy, and no bitterness. It's as if he's just happy to be alive.

I always thought Millsap was this way, but the NBA has corrupted him a bit. He's cynical (probably deservedly about the refs), bitter and has some feeling of entitlement. He insists that he must be a starter, when he would make a perfect backup for this team. I would be calling for the Jazz to wrap up Millsap in a nice, juicy long term contract if I knew he would continue to play hard and would be willing to accept any role asked of him. At this point, I'm not so sure. Unfortunately, they should probably let him walk.

I really hope they wrap up DC. I also really hope he keeps his current frame of mind. It is players like DC (and the former Paul Millsap) that keep me watching the NBA.
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PostSubject: Re: DC Deserves His Own Thread   Fri Apr 19, 2013 7:57 am

thejazzkickazz wrote:
Mutangclan wrote:
Seriously. Could you possibly love this guy any more???? Does all the right things, says all the right things, plays his ass off.......


Get this guy a 4 year contract and be done with it:

http://www.sltrib.com/sltrib/jazz/56181712-87/jazz-carroll-param-value.html.csp

I saw that Trib piece and fell even more in purely Platonic man-love with DC. It's really incredible what a great attitude this guy has. He doesn't demand minutes (but deserves way more), isn't money grubbing and is willing to work hard, sacrifice every day and do all of the dirty work. There's no diva in this guy, and no bitterness. It's as if he's just happy to be alive.

I always thought Millsap was this way, but the NBA has corrupted him a bit. He's cynical (probably deservedly about the refs), bitter and has some feeling of entitlement. He insists that he must be a starter, when he would make a perfect backup for this team. I would be calling for the Jazz to wrap up Millsap in a nice, juicy long term contract if I knew he would continue to play hard and would be willing to accept any role asked of him. At this point, I'm not so sure. Unfortunately, they should probably let him walk.

I really hope they wrap up DC. I also really hope he keeps his current frame of mind. It is players like DC (and the former Paul Millsap) that keep me watching the NBA.

Yeah it has been reported by guys that are with the team everyday, that Milsap has had an attitude problem all year. I've seen in in interviews and stuff, but I'm not nearly close enough to the team to make that judgment. It's 100% obvious that Paul's run in Utah is over.

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PostSubject: Re: DC Deserves His Own Thread   Fri Apr 19, 2013 9:26 am

Romoholic wrote:
thejazzkickazz wrote:
Mutangclan wrote:
Seriously. Could you possibly love this guy any more???? Does all the right things, says all the right things, plays his ass off.......


Get this guy a 4 year contract and be done with it:

http://www.sltrib.com/sltrib/jazz/56181712-87/jazz-carroll-param-value.html.csp

I saw that Trib piece and fell even more in purely Platonic man-love with DC. It's really incredible what a great attitude this guy has. He doesn't demand minutes (but deserves way more), isn't money grubbing and is willing to work hard, sacrifice every day and do all of the dirty work. There's no diva in this guy, and no bitterness. It's as if he's just happy to be alive.

I always thought Millsap was this way, but the NBA has corrupted him a bit. He's cynical (probably deservedly about the refs), bitter and has some feeling of entitlement. He insists that he must be a starter, when he would make a perfect backup for this team. I would be calling for the Jazz to wrap up Millsap in a nice, juicy long term contract if I knew he would continue to play hard and would be willing to accept any role asked of him. At this point, I'm not so sure. Unfortunately, they should probably let him walk.

I really hope they wrap up DC. I also really hope he keeps his current frame of mind. It is players like DC (and the former Paul Millsap) that keep me watching the NBA.

Yeah it has been reported by guys that are with the team everyday, that Milsap has had an attitude problem all year. I've seen in in interviews and stuff, but I'm not nearly close enough to the team to make that judgment. It's 100% obvious that Paul's run in Utah is over.

Milsap has been one of my Favorite Jazz players for the last few seasons and if this is true about him having some kind of attitude problem it will make me have take a different view of who he really is but to tell the truth after the all star brake something was going on with this team and something like this could have been the reason they fell apart like they did.

I have already talked about how I would take Jefferson over Milsap because of how Al has worked with Favors and Kanter over the summer and into the season to help both of them take big steps this season into becoming very good players for the Jazz. I think these 3 have built up a very strong relationship with each other and really want to play with each other so I want the Jazz to try to keep Al around if at all possible and even more so now after seeing these things being said about Milsap. Lets just hope that the Jazz can find some way to get something of value in a sign and trade with Milsap this summer that will net them something like they did with Boozer or anything that they could use to better the team.

I am all for the Jazz wrapping up DC long term the guy has proven himself as far as I am concerned and lets hope the Jazz see things the same way as most of us do about this guy and I am sure they do. I really like the core group of this Young Jazz team Favors, Kanter, DC, Hayward, Burks and Evens this is a very talented group of players and are now starting to step up their play showing they are the players everyone thought they was.

I have to say that Evens play when he was able to get on the floor was a very good surprise for me the guy was hitting the outside shot and was looking very good doing it, there is no doubt that he has worked hard on that part of his game and with that kind of shot in his game he is a whole new player now and could be a very good PF/SF type for the Jazz. The only thing that I think was keeping Evens from being a good SF was because he could not hit outside shots that's just something that a small forward needs to do and now that Evens has that shot in his game he could become a very good player at the SF position IMHO.
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PostSubject: Re: DC Deserves His Own Thread   Fri Apr 19, 2013 12:46 pm

dongibby wrote:


I have to say that Evens play when he was able to get on the floor was a very good surprise for me the guy was hitting the outside shot and was looking very good doing it, there is no doubt that he has worked hard on that part of his game and with that kind of shot in his game he is a whole new player now and could be a very good PF/SF type for the Jazz. The only thing that I think was keeping Evens from being a good SF was because he could not hit outside shots that's just something that a small forward needs to do and now that Evens has that shot in his game he could become a very good player at the SF position IMHO.

Good points about Evans, Don. He's the guy I always forget to include with our other young guys.

You do realize the Jazz drafted him ONLY because they got hold of some statistical info from his coach and realized his athletic gifts were off the charts, right? He had really never had to develop real "basketball playing skills" because of those gifts.

And yet, when he got to play this year (those RARE occasions), you could see the change from his rookie year, when he never dribbled or passed or shot from anywhere but 0 feet. He DID dribble! He passed, and well! And he even hit some jumpers, which, I'm pretty sure, weren't a big part of his game coming out of school.

So yeah, he appears to have spent a lot of time (successfully!) building his skillset. Hopefully, we'll finally get to see what the Jazz have with this kid next year. He's never going to be a power forward who'll be good defending guys like Pau Gasol or Randolph, but anyone other than a bruiser he ought to be able to cause some problems. And he may not be quick enough to handle the quickest drive-it-to-the-hoop small forwards...but he's SO long and jumps SO quick and SO high he can still be effective against most.

I hope we get to see some of that next year. A lineup of, say, Favors, Evans, DC, Hayward and Burks and WOW!! What a nightmare for opposing offenses!! Size, length, athleticism, hustle...could be EPIC!!
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PostSubject: Re: DC Deserves His Own Thread   Fri Apr 19, 2013 2:44 pm

Romoholic wrote:


Yeah it has been reported by guys that are with the team everyday, that Milsap has had an attitude problem all year. I've seen in in interviews and stuff, but I'm not nearly close enough to the team to make that judgment. It's 100% obvious that Paul's run in Utah is over.

Millsap said, "Dealing with free agency, dealing with the rotation … it was tough for everybody, from the players to the coaches to the management."

Asked if he kept the issues from distracting him, Millsap said, "Personally, I’m human, so no. That’s me being honest."



Well there you have it.
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PostSubject: Re: DC Deserves His Own Thread   Fri Apr 19, 2013 3:10 pm

zero24gravity wrote:
Romoholic wrote:


Yeah it has been reported by guys that are with the team everyday, that Milsap has had an attitude problem all year. I've seen in in interviews and stuff, but I'm not nearly close enough to the team to make that judgment. It's 100% obvious that Paul's run in Utah is over.

Millsap said, "Dealing with free agency, dealing with the rotation … it was tough for everybody, from the players to the coaches to the management."

Asked if he kept the issues from distracting him, Millsap said, "Personally, I’m human, so no. That’s me being honest."



Well there you have it.

He was offered an extension and turned it down. From that point on he should have sucked it up and been a professional about it. He made the decision to make this a limbo season for him and he failed to do anything to warrant a bigger contract than what the Jazz offered him.

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PostSubject: Re: DC Deserves His Own Thread   Fri Apr 19, 2013 5:08 pm

Romoholic wrote:
zero24gravity wrote:
Romoholic wrote:


Yeah it has been reported by guys that are with the team everyday, that Milsap has had an attitude problem all year. I've seen in in interviews and stuff, but I'm not nearly close enough to the team to make that judgment. It's 100% obvious that Paul's run in Utah is over.

Millsap said, "Dealing with free agency, dealing with the rotation … it was tough for everybody, from the players to the coaches to the management."

Asked if he kept the issues from distracting him, Millsap said, "Personally, I’m human, so no. That’s me being honest."



Well there you have it.

He was offered an extension and turned it down. From that point on he should have sucked it up and been a professional about it. He made the decision to make this a limbo season for him and he failed to do anything to warrant a bigger contract than what the Jazz offered him.

Sad but true.

Paul's not dumb, but I don't know if it occurred to him that, in trusting his agent, he was committing to advice from someone who valued only one thing: the 5% of whatever Paul gets paid. Not saying he should disregard financial considerations, but he should also realize that $10 million+happy+winning is better than $13 million+going 20-62+living in Cleveland or Seatramento. His agent sees $12 mill> $10 mill, and that's it.

He should've taken the extension. His unhappiness and play may have cost him the pie-in-the-sky contract his agent was dreaming of. (That now-squandered 'good soldier' rep had monetary value, o yes it did) And he's wasted a year of his career being unhappy. Crying or Very sad
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PostSubject: Re: DC Deserves His Own Thread   Fri Apr 19, 2013 5:27 pm

Trollificus wrote:
Romoholic wrote:
zero24gravity wrote:
Romoholic wrote:


Yeah it has been reported by guys that are with the team everyday, that Milsap has had an attitude problem all year. I've seen in in interviews and stuff, but I'm not nearly close enough to the team to make that judgment. It's 100% obvious that Paul's run in Utah is over.

Millsap said, "Dealing with free agency, dealing with the rotation … it was tough for everybody, from the players to the coaches to the management."

Asked if he kept the issues from distracting him, Millsap said, "Personally, I’m human, so no. That’s me being honest."



Well there you have it.

He was offered an extension and turned it down. From that point on he should have sucked it up and been a professional about it. He made the decision to make this a limbo season for him and he failed to do anything to warrant a bigger contract than what the Jazz offered him.

Sad but true.

Paul's not dumb, but I don't know if it occurred to him that, in trusting his agent, he was committing to advice from someone who valued only one thing: the 5% of whatever Paul gets paid. Not saying he should disregard financial considerations, but he should also realize that $10 million+happy+winning is better than $13 million+going 20-62+living in Cleveland or Seatramento. His agent sees $12 mill> $10 mill, and that's it.

He should've taken the extension. His unhappiness and play may have cost him the pie-in-the-sky contract his agent was dreaming of. (That now-squandered 'good soldier' rep had monetary value, o yes it did) And he's wasted a year of his career being unhappy. Crying or Very sad

I always found this line of thought very naive.

He couldn't have got 10 Mil a year on an extension, his max extension was about $27 Million total for 3 years. His contract this summer will probably be worth at least $35-40 Million over 4 years, no player in their late 20's makes that deal so they can play for a team that could just turn around and trade them tomorrow, and I think it's off-base to think he should have taken it or he's somehow not being loyal or not acting the same way anybody else would.
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PostSubject: Re: DC Deserves His Own Thread   Fri Apr 19, 2013 6:02 pm

TheMagnus wrote:
Trollificus wrote:
Romoholic wrote:
zero24gravity wrote:
Romoholic wrote:


Yeah it has been reported by guys that are with the team everyday, that Milsap has had an attitude problem all year. I've seen in in interviews and stuff, but I'm not nearly close enough to the team to make that judgment. It's 100% obvious that Paul's run in Utah is over.

Millsap said, "Dealing with free agency, dealing with the rotation … it was tough for everybody, from the players to the coaches to the management."

Asked if he kept the issues from distracting him, Millsap said, "Personally, I’m human, so no. That’s me being honest."



Well there you have it.

He was offered an extension and turned it down. From that point on he should have sucked it up and been a professional about it. He made the decision to make this a limbo season for him and he failed to do anything to warrant a bigger contract than what the Jazz offered him.

Sad but true.

Paul's not dumb, but I don't know if it occurred to him that, in trusting his agent, he was committing to advice from someone who valued only one thing: the 5% of whatever Paul gets paid. Not saying he should disregard financial considerations, but he should also realize that $10 million+happy+winning is better than $13 million+going 20-62+living in Cleveland or Seatramento. His agent sees $12 mill> $10 mill, and that's it.

He should've taken the extension. His unhappiness and play may have cost him the pie-in-the-sky contract his agent was dreaming of. (That now-squandered 'good soldier' rep had monetary value, o yes it did) And he's wasted a year of his career being unhappy. Crying or Very sad

I always found this line of thought very naive.

He couldn't have got 10 Mil a year on an extension, his max extension was about $27 Million total for 3 years. His contract this summer will probably be worth at least $35-40 Million over 4 years, no player in their late 20's makes that deal so they can play for a team that could just turn around and trade them tomorrow, and I think it's off-base to think he should have taken it or he's somehow not being loyal or not acting the same way anybody else would.

Maybe so. Do you think he'll get $10 mill +/year??
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PostSubject: Re: DC Deserves His Own Thread   Fri Apr 19, 2013 6:11 pm

Trollificus wrote:
TheMagnus wrote:


I always found this line of thought very naive.

He couldn't have got 10 Mil a year on an extension, his max extension was about $27 Million total for 3 years. His contract this summer will probably be worth at least $35-40 Million over 4 years, no player in their late 20's makes that deal so they can play for a team that could just turn around and trade them tomorrow, and I think it's off-base to think he should have taken it or he's somehow not being loyal or not acting the same way anybody else would.

Maybe so. Do you think he'll get $10 mill +/year??

I think it's a sellers market this year so it's not unlikely, seems highly unlikely that his deal is worth less than 9 Mil a year. And even if he doesn't, that extra year is huge. He's 28, at the peak of his career, he'll be on the wrong side of 30 when his next contract expires, so this summer is all about maximum total guaranteed money, and extra years are the way you do that.
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PostSubject: Re: DC Deserves His Own Thread   Fri Apr 19, 2013 6:35 pm

TheMagnus wrote:
Trollificus wrote:
TheMagnus wrote:


I always found this line of thought very naive.

He couldn't have got 10 Mil a year on an extension, his max extension was about $27 Million total for 3 years. His contract this summer will probably be worth at least $35-40 Million over 4 years, no player in their late 20's makes that deal so they can play for a team that could just turn around and trade them tomorrow, and I think it's off-base to think he should have taken it or he's somehow not being loyal or not acting the same way anybody else would.

Maybe so. Do you think he'll get $10 mill +/year??

I think it's a sellers market this year so it's not unlikely, seems highly unlikely that his deal is worth less than 9 Mil a year. And even if he doesn't, that extra year is huge. He's 28, at the peak of his career, he'll be on the wrong side of 30 when his next contract expires, so this summer is all about maximum total guaranteed money, and extra years are the way you do that.

Maybe, being an old hippie, I'm just not materialistic enough for 21st century America, but it seems like risking a lot of losing and unhappiness in an unnecessary attempt to avoid ever having to do any gainful work for the rest of your life. (Which, to me, seems as achievable with $30 million as with 40).

So yeah, it was naive. But then, I've passed on money several times in my life and never regretted it. So I was just wondering if there's a downside to "maximizing total guaranteed money" and realized that's a pretty subjective question.
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PostSubject: Re: DC Deserves His Own Thread   Fri Apr 19, 2013 6:54 pm

Trollificus wrote:
TheMagnus wrote:
Trollificus wrote:
TheMagnus wrote:


I always found this line of thought very naive.

He couldn't have got 10 Mil a year on an extension, his max extension was about $27 Million total for 3 years. His contract this summer will probably be worth at least $35-40 Million over 4 years, no player in their late 20's makes that deal so they can play for a team that could just turn around and trade them tomorrow, and I think it's off-base to think he should have taken it or he's somehow not being loyal or not acting the same way anybody else would.

Maybe so. Do you think he'll get $10 mill +/year??

I think it's a sellers market this year so it's not unlikely, seems highly unlikely that his deal is worth less than 9 Mil a year. And even if he doesn't, that extra year is huge. He's 28, at the peak of his career, he'll be on the wrong side of 30 when his next contract expires, so this summer is all about maximum total guaranteed money, and extra years are the way you do that.

Maybe, being an old hippie, I'm just not materialistic enough for 21st century America, but it seems like risking a lot of losing and unhappiness in an unnecessary attempt to avoid ever having to do any gainful work for the rest of your life. (Which, to me, seems as achievable with $30 million as with 40).

So yeah, it was naive. But then, I've passed on money several times in my life and never regretted it. So I was just wondering if there's a downside to "maximizing total guaranteed money" and realized that's a pretty subjective question.

You're nothing but a dirty hippie! And you're probably a communist, too! How could you pass up money? I'll bet you wish our currency was pink instead of green.

Seriously, though, I totally agree with your line of thinking, and this is one of the things that makes watching the NBA so difficult. These young men with their amazing skill to put a round leather ball through a metallic hoop-shaped object have their perspectives all outta whack and amazingly skeewhompus. Seriously, $30m vs. $40m? When you get up to those lofty numbers, does it really matter? Maybe to your children's children's children's children, but they will probably all be fighting off Kevin Costner on his catamaran of death anyway. If Millsap was of sound mind, he would have agreed to that contract extension, taken whatever role the coaching staff expected of him and shut the ****** up. If he gave half the effort he exhibited during his first five years or so in the league, he would have been forever revered by Jazz fans, win or lose. He would have his name in the Jazz record books as a top-10 performer in several statistics. He would be asked back for dinners, speeches and who knows what until his grand old age.

Instead, he has chosen to be surly and bitter, imagining that the franchise has ill-used him and disrespected him by even suggesting that young whippersnappers like Derrick Favors and Enes Kanter might, at this moment in time, deserve a few more of his minutes. Paul Millsap has been corrupted by the league, by the nasty atmosphere that seems to plague the NBA, where players perceive themselves as the gods of little floating islands, with worshippers screaming and throwing little pickles at them. WTF has the NBA become, other than a collection of divas, worshipped from the time they are 8-years old and 6'4", with promises that 'mama ain't never gonna have to work again'. I'm telling you, when a guy like Paul Millsap becomes corrupted by the system, it makes it hard to continue to be a fan.

Wow, now I'm breathing hard. Rant over.
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PostSubject: Re: DC Deserves His Own Thread   Fri Apr 19, 2013 9:02 pm

Mutangclan wrote:
Seriously. Could you possibly love this guy any more???? Does all the right things, says all the right things, plays his ass off.......


Get this guy a 4 year contract and be done with it:

http://www.sltrib.com/sltrib/jazz/56181712-87/jazz-carroll-param-value.html.csp

Sign the same contract? Sounds great for us, but Junkyard Dog might not be be talking the same way after he has a sit down with his agent and his agent forcefully explains to him that he is worth a lot more this summer than he was last summer.
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PostSubject: Re: DC Deserves His Own Thread   Fri Apr 19, 2013 9:10 pm

thejazzkickazz wrote:
Trollificus wrote:
TheMagnus wrote:
Trollificus wrote:
TheMagnus wrote:


I always found this line of thought very naive.

He couldn't have got 10 Mil a year on an extension, his max extension was about $27 Million total for 3 years. His contract this summer will probably be worth at least $35-40 Million over 4 years, no player in their late 20's makes that deal so they can play for a team that could just turn around and trade them tomorrow, and I think it's off-base to think he should have taken it or he's somehow not being loyal or not acting the same way anybody else would.

Maybe so. Do you think he'll get $10 mill +/year??

I think it's a sellers market this year so it's not unlikely, seems highly unlikely that his deal is worth less than 9 Mil a year. And even if he doesn't, that extra year is huge. He's 28, at the peak of his career, he'll be on the wrong side of 30 when his next contract expires, so this summer is all about maximum total guaranteed money, and extra years are the way you do that.

Maybe, being an old hippie, I'm just not materialistic enough for 21st century America, but it seems like risking a lot of losing and unhappiness in an unnecessary attempt to avoid ever having to do any gainful work for the rest of your life. (Which, to me, seems as achievable with $30 million as with 40).

So yeah, it was naive. But then, I've passed on money several times in my life and never regretted it. So I was just wondering if there's a downside to "maximizing total guaranteed money" and realized that's a pretty subjective question.

You're nothing but a dirty hippie! And you're probably a communist, too! How could you pass up money? I'll bet you wish our currency was pink instead of green.

Seriously, though, I totally agree with your line of thinking, and this is one of the things that makes watching the NBA so difficult. These young men with their amazing skill to put a round leather ball through a metallic hoop-shaped object have their perspectives all outta whack and amazingly skeewhompus. Seriously, $30m vs. $40m? When you get up to those lofty numbers, does it really matter? Maybe to your children's children's children's children, but they will probably all be fighting off Kevin Costner on his catamaran of death anyway. If Millsap was of sound mind, he would have agreed to that contract extension, taken whatever role the coaching staff expected of him and shut the ****** up. If he gave half the effort he exhibited during his first five years or so in the league, he would have been forever revered by Jazz fans, win or lose. He would have his name in the Jazz record books as a top-10 performer in several statistics. He would be asked back for dinners, speeches and who knows what until his grand old age.

Instead, he has chosen to be surly and bitter, imagining that the franchise has ill-used him and disrespected him by even suggesting that young whippersnappers like Derrick Favors and Enes Kanter might, at this moment in time, deserve a few more of his minutes. Paul Millsap has been corrupted by the league, by the nasty atmosphere that seems to plague the NBA, where players perceive themselves as the gods of little floating islands, with worshippers screaming and throwing little pickles at them. WTF has the NBA become, other than a collection of divas, worshipped from the time they are 8-years old and 6'4", with promises that 'mama ain't never gonna have to work again'. I'm telling you, when a guy like Paul Millsap becomes corrupted by the system, it makes it hard to continue to be a fan.

Wow, now I'm breathing hard. Rant over.

c-mon guys, those are lovely hippie rants but how about you come back to the real world.

Maybe he's not happy in Utah? Maybe he's tired of playing for a team and a fan base that seems like it just wants to use him up in an endless rebuild and then put him away like an old work horse when something shiny and new comes along? Maybe he's watched his best friends be traded and let go for 5 years and watched the fans boo them on their return and debate their value like they are meat and he, like every other NBA player his age, has realized that all of that bullshit about loyalty and respect isn't worth the shovel that's tossing it. Hell after 7 years of doing everything in his power to better himself and help the Jazz win it only took 5 bad games for half of Jazz fans to say they are done with him and hope he doesn't come back, calling him a quitter and questioning his character when he went out and went to work every night and did what he has always done, but he TOTALLY should be taking a millions of dollars less than he's worth to come back and cement his "legacy" for Utah, we've totally earned that from him, and he owes it to us...right, that's how it is.
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PostSubject: Re: DC Deserves His Own Thread   Fri Apr 19, 2013 11:33 pm

*sigh*

This is going to be like Calg's "Sloan ruined AK" thing??

Then I just surrender. We betrayed him. Just used him. Set him to work in the dank basketball mines for a pittance and then turned our backs on him.

Your faith in Millsaps flawless virtue and unflagging effort definitely out-passions (and out-sarcasms) my slight disappointment with him.
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