The Home of the greatest fans in the NBA!
 
HomeHome    CalendarCalendar  GalleryGallery  FAQFAQ  SearchSearch  MemberlistMemberlist  UsergroupsUsergroups  RegisterRegister  Log inLog in  

Share | 
 

 Change.org Fire Coach T

View previous topic View next topic Go down 
Go to page : Previous  1, 2, 3, 4  Next
AuthorMessage
Saint Louis
Starter


Posts : 382
Points : 473
Reputation : 8
Join date : 2012-04-28

PostSubject: Re: Change.org Fire Coach T   Sat Apr 06, 2013 11:53 pm

Romoholic wrote:
Mutangclan wrote:
Saint Louis wrote:
Mutangclan wrote:
You boys and girls forward this to all your friends. Again, dont kid myself that I think Rigby/KOC/Lindsey will look at this at all, but it is the only thing out there with a Jazz Fans voice.

MuTang, you know I've backed you up many times in the past. But, your fire Corbin campaign has gone completely off-base and has no merits other than pathetic echoes by smaller minds with internet access.

I've listened patiently as you and others have continually posted about how Burks and DC are the answers to all the Jazz' woes. I haven't wanted to say too much because I have high hopes for DC and Burks. But, give me a f-ing break-- DC and Burks both are high-energy low talent players that probably would not get a chance to play on any playoff-bound team. We're a middle of the road team, and DC and Burks are at best middle of the road 2nd stringers.

Mu Tang (and others), you have completely lost perspective in your hatred of Ty and how you look at Jazz games. As a PG, Burks is probably our 4th best option. As a SG, Burks is behind Heyhay, Foye, and DC (not to mention Mo at the SG). As a SG/SF swing, DC is behind Heyhay and Foye, and, IMO, Marvin Williams. I'm not saying Burks and DC are useless-- but, Burks rarely merits playing time, and DC SHOULD get more emergency play at the sg/sf position.

With the most recent criticisms of how Ty coached our team against Denver, it is easy for me to see how myopic (short-sighted, unable to see the big picture) you (Mu) and others are when looking at Jazz games. There were no complaints about the Jazz in the first half. No one mentioned how badly the Jazz were outmatched once Corey Brewer came in for Denver's 2nd unit. We all love Heyhay, but, Brewer came in fresh and tore him apart.

Then, as everyone on this site seems to agree, the Jazz went from a team equal to Denver to a sub-par team at the beginning of the 3rd quarter.. The Jazz starters of Mo Williams, Randy Foye, Gordan Hayward, Paul Millsap, and Al Jefferson gave away eight straight points to the Nugs. But, let's look at what happened. We started with a possession and Millsap missed on a pretty good look. Koufos rebounded, but, we played good defense and got a steal (by Foye). Then Heyhay missed an open 3pt shot and Koufos rebounded. We played good defense and Big Al got the rebound. We moved the ball around on offense, then Mo took it to the rim and was blocked by Koufos, who also got the rebound. We played good defense and Millsap got the rebound. Then, Heyhay missed another open shot and Koufos got the rebound. We played pretty good defense, but with two seconds left on the shot clock Iguadala nailed a lucky 3pt shot. Two minutes into the 3rd quarter and Denver breaks the defensive tie. Now, this is the point where
Denver is about to break lose, or, this is where the Jazz simply answer a 3-0 two minutes with a basket to make it 3-2 for the first 3 minutes of the 3rd quarter. Foye misses a desperation 3pt shot with one second left on the shot clock and Faried gets the defensive rebound. 13 seconds later Gallinari beats Heyhay to the hoop and makes a lay-up-- Foye fouls him too late to stop the shot from going in. He makes the free throw. IS THIS WHERE TY SHOULD HAVE TAKEN OUT OUR STARTERS? And if Ty takes anyone out, who should it be? Mo is distributing well on offense, but no one is hitting their open shots. Mo has played solid defense so far in the 3rd quarter, so there is no reason to take him out. Foye is actually playing great defense, and, aside from missing a desperation three, he has done nothing wrong. Heyhay has missed some open looks and is getting destroyed by Denver's Gallinari/Iguadala combo. (But, Heyward is really one of our best players, so, how the hell can we take HIM out?) Millsap has completely neutralized his opponent, and, his opponent has completely neutralized Millsap. Big Al hasn't taken a shot yet in the 3rd quarter, and that MUST be confusing for someone who most every expert in NBA analysis says is one of the best 15 players in the entire NBA. SO, IF TY MAKES ANY CHANGES, WHAT ARE THEY? Ty doesn't take a timeout, and Mo ends up taking another desperation 3, which misses, and 23 seconds later Iguadal beats Heyhay to the rim for a dunk-- that's eight points in a row for Denver, and they all came from Iguadala and Gallineri. Heyhay is getting burned left and right. IT'S AN 8-0 RUN 4 MINUTES INTO THE 3RD QUARTER! WHAT SHOULD TY DO?

An 8-0 run over 4 minutes is not really something any NBA coach should worry too much about. The opponents getting 8 pts in a 4 minute span is completely acceptable. What IS worth worrying about is the complete lack of scoring. And, at this point in the game, the Jazz already have their best scorers on the floor. They need a change in mind-sets, and possible personnel! At this point the Jazz players played better. Foye and Jefferson became very active offensively. They made some and missed some. But Faried abused Millsap on the offensive end. Millsap finally got to the rim and was fouled, to make two free throws, but TY decided Favors was a better matchup at PF, and pulled Millsap. This actually worked until Denver inserted Corey Brewer back into the game.

When Corey Brewer re-entered the game shortly into the 4th quarter, the Nuggets were on cruise control. Imagine the world's best janitor asked to clean up a mess with only 4 co-workers. Brewer barely did anything remarkable in the 4th quarter He just cleaned it up and made sure everyone punched the clock. Blame Ty if you want-- but, I don't think anyone on this site could have coached the Jazz more efficiently. I really think this whole "Fire Ty" campaign is complete bullshit, driven by desires that are not entirely rooted in reality. Sorry, forumotioners-- I ain't with you on this one.

Interesting. Lets point out the elephant in the room first: This entire forum is BULLSHIT. All this stuff we talk about is bullshit, all of our opinions on here are bullshit, all of our arguments our bullshit, the "better ways" to manage the team on here are bullshit. AND THAT IS THE POINT OF IT, correct?


Hey I resemble that statement!

Quite the finger pointing there guy. But one thing to point out first. It was not my petition, someone else started it, I just found it and passed it on. But for you to come on here and blast away, calling other fans and their opinions "small minds", is a bit much. Maybe come down off that horse for a second. They're opinions, nothing more, nothing less. And your opinion is no better than those "small minded" folks, no better than mine. Shoot, it isn't even better than Calgary's.

It's also very interesting that you're so serious about a petition that I have more than once pointed out that I fully well know is not going anywhere and is just a fun thing to dream about. There is no way in hell the Jazz front office is going to see it, and even if they did, there is no way in hell they would give it a second thought. And I've repeated that since it came on here.

I'm a Jazz fan, and a frustrated fan at that. If you dont like fans expressing their opinions, emotional or not, that too bad for you pally. Thats the entire point of this forum. The most interesting part of it all, is that you can come on here and tell me that I've completely lost perspective on the team that I watch every game of, and that my opinion of Burks and DC is completely WRONG. But I have news for you, if you actually do believe that Burks and DC are low talent players that dont help a team immensely, then you dont know nearly as much as you seem to think you do.

The other part of that is I NEVER said DC and Burks were the answer to all the teams woe's. I've said that Corbin should play the players that give the team the best chance to win. THAT IS ALL. I'm not making out to be more than they are. Oh, and not coincidentally, the numbers show that I am right. (and since I dont carry as much weight around here, Magnus also has felt the same.)

If you think that Burks is our fourth best option at PG, then you are coming across as someone who is not very knowledgeable of the game.
We actually say that Burks was the second best option at PG while Mo was out

Funny, lumping me into the Denver game talk. I believe all I said was "nice rotations Tyrone". That was it. But calling me shortsighted and unable to see the big picture.....hmmmm. Interesting. Somebody really needs to slow their roll, eh?

I have been consistent all year long, that there needs to be a balance to the starting and second units. Been a broken record. And since Al/Mo are two of the worst defenders going, we need IN MY OPINION, to have other good defenders on the court. Also, very few disagree that Foye is not a starting type player, that he is best suited as a hired gun off the bench. He also is not a very good defender. DC fills this roll perfectly and balance's out the first unit. And Foye coming off the bench, also balances out the 2nd unit as a scorer that is now needed with Gordon starting.
Lastly, Tinsely and Watson should never play. It's not opinion, its fact backed up by numbers, statistics, and knowledge of watching the game. It's best for the team now, in the future, and to win games if Burks plays the back up PG. Thats NOT opinion.

Very interesting that you come on here posting as if you are right in all your assessments, and everyone else is wrong. That only you can see the big picture, but I can't....very interesting.......Im sorry you are so bothered by other peoples opinions on a site developed to have opinions posted. But just because you have opinions on others, and the Jazz, doesn't mean you're right.






Honestly though saint louis, it's not cool to come on here and start name calling and shit because you don't agree with other people's opinions.

I actually went and signed the petition, because while i think it's a little pointless, I do think that Jazz management needs to know that the fans are very unhappy with the Job Corbin is doing! I can guarantee they know the petition is out there, cause I tweeted the link to Greg Miller.

The simple fact is that it's not just a few disgruntled Jazz fans that are bashing Ty. A lot of the national media is seeing it and it's being talked about in NBA circles. I listen to internet radio all day and hear it brought up pretty often.

I appreciate your response when you say, "Honestly though saint louis, it's not cool to come on here and start name calling and shit because you don't agree with other people's opinions." YOU ARE NOT AT ALL A MORON. I don't have much of a reference, though, for your accuracy on what is "cool" and what is not cool. Miles Davis. Is Miles Davis cool?

I do hope, though, that MuTang was wrong when he said that this site was created so everyone could post BULLSHIT. I have higher hopes for this site. I hope you do as well.

I'm not calling anyone on this site a complete pissant, or, even a knee-jerk reactionary ass-wipe. I think Jazz fans on and off this site are smarter than most basketball fans. If I bother to disagree with a Jazz fan, you better believe it's out of respect. I would not bother to respond to someone I thought was idiotic. I DO apalogize for using the phrase "small minds" referring to the posters I didn't feel merited a response-- they are not small-minded-- it just seemed to me they were jumping on a bad bandwagon without much more than the momentum already presented.

So, cool or not, I'll continue to post-- unless you don't want to hear it. And, if you don't want to hear it... well, I won't object too much. There's a possibility I'm wrong about everything I say. I'm willing to look at it, and look at opposing views, and move on. I think I'm right in not jumping on the "fire Ty" bandwagon. I may be wrong. Would you prefer I didn't voice my opinion? Would you be happy with a "Hell yeah, fire Ty" even though the Jazz are doing better than most experts predicted? (Go back to pre-season predictions, and you'll see the Jazz are doing better than predicted.)
Back to top Go down
View user profile
Crunchtime1
Starter


Posts : 339
Points : 395
Reputation : 15
Join date : 2012-04-27

PostSubject: Re: Change.org Fire Coach T   Sun Apr 07, 2013 10:54 am

Saint Louis wrote:
Would you be happy with a "Hell yeah, fire Ty" even though the Jazz are doing better than most experts predicted? (Go back to pre-season predictions, and you'll see the Jazz are doing better than predicted.)

Yes, I would. Smile I'll take your word for it that the "experts" predicted the Jazz to do worse, but underestimating the Jazz has become a regular, yearly occurrence that means little when it comes to evaluating our Coach imho. A couple of things I find particularly disturbing about this season is that not only do probabilities now say the Jazz are likely to miss the playoffs, but that the Jazz will most certainly finish with a worse winning percentage than they did last season, notwithstanding the fact that young players Kanter, Hayward, Favors, DC, Burks and Evans have all shown themselves capable of bringing much more to the table than they brought last year. With all those young guys having another year under their belts and at least two of them playing well above the most optimistic predictions, Kanter and DC, we should have at bare minimum had a better winning percentage than last season imo. Of course offsetting this conclusion was the downgrade at PG position with no Harris and the loss of Mo for a substantial period, but even there, it seems like the loss of Mo could have been mitigated somewhat by moving Hayward in to the starting lineup earlier as a point wing and giving Burks more burn.

On a more Machiavellian note, my above paragraph is also surreptitiously serving as a setup for the Jazz to beat Golden State today and for the Lakers to lose the Clippers today, thus increasing the Jazz' playoff chances and their winning percentage. The NBA never misses a chance to make a fool out of me for my predictions. LOL. GO JAZZ!!!!
Back to top Go down
View user profile
TheMagnus
Admin
avatar

Posts : 1765
Points : 2172
Reputation : 75
Join date : 2012-04-26

PostSubject: Re: Change.org Fire Coach T   Sun Apr 07, 2013 11:45 am

Crunchtime1 wrote:
Saint Louis wrote:
Would you be happy with a "Hell yeah, fire Ty" even though the Jazz are doing better than most experts predicted? (Go back to pre-season predictions, and you'll see the Jazz are doing better than predicted.)

Yes, I would. Smile I'll take your word for it that the "experts" predicted the Jazz to do worse, but underestimating the Jazz has become a regular, yearly occurrence that means little when it comes to evaluating our Coach imho. A couple of things I find particularly disturbing about this season is that not only do probabilities now say the Jazz are likely to miss the playoffs, but that the Jazz will most certainly finish with a worse winning percentage than they did last season, notwithstanding the fact that young players Kanter, Hayward, Favors, DC, Burks and Evans have all shown themselves capable of bringing much more to the table than they brought last year. With all those young guys having another year under their belts and at least two of them playing well above the most optimistic predictions, Kanter and DC, we should have at bare minimum had a better winning percentage than last season imo. Of course offsetting this conclusion was the downgrade at PG position with no Harris and the loss of Mo for a substantial period, but even there, it seems like the loss of Mo could have been mitigated somewhat by moving Hayward in to the starting lineup earlier as a point wing and giving Burks more burn.

On a more Machiavellian note, my above paragraph is also surreptitiously serving as a setup for the Jazz to beat Golden State today and for the Lakers to lose the Clippers today, thus increasing the Jazz' playoff chances and their winning percentage. The NBA never misses a chance to make a fool out of me for my predictions. LOL. GO JAZZ!!!!

Don't forget that going in to this season the following was assumed to be true...

Mo Williams > Devin Harris
Randy Foye > Raja Bell
Marvin Williams >> Josh Howard

Add to that the improvement of young players and the rise of Demarre Carroll I don't think anybody could reasonably say that on paper this team is worse than last years team, and most would say it was much better, yet there has been no improvement in the overall performance. Now everyone has a theory on why that is, and I've got a few of my own including the fact that I think last years team over-achieved, but it's very difficult to not hang at least some of that failure on coaching.

Back to top Go down
View user profile
Mutangclan
Hall Of Famer
avatar

Posts : 1296
Points : 1397
Reputation : 73
Join date : 2012-04-26

PostSubject: Re: Change.org Fire Coach T   Sun Apr 07, 2013 3:51 pm

Saint Louis wrote:

I appreciate your response when you say, "Honestly though saint louis, it's not cool to come on here and start name calling and shit because you don't agree with other people's opinions." YOU ARE NOT AT ALL A MORON. I don't have much of a reference, though, for your accuracy on what is "cool" and what is not cool. Miles Davis. Is Miles Davis cool?

I do hope, though, that MuTang was wrong when he said that this site was created so everyone could post BULLSHIT. I have higher hopes for this site. I hope you do as well.

I'm not calling anyone on this site a complete pissant, or, even a knee-jerk reactionary ass-wipe. I think Jazz fans on and off this site are smarter than most basketball fans. If I bother to disagree with a Jazz fan, you better believe it's out of respect. I would not bother to respond to someone I thought was idiotic. I DO apalogize for using the phrase "small minds" referring to the posters I didn't feel merited a response-- they are not small-minded-- it just seemed to me they were jumping on a bad bandwagon without much more than the momentum already presented.

So, cool or not, I'll continue to post-- unless you don't want to hear it. And, if you don't want to hear it... well, I won't object too much. There's a possibility I'm wrong about everything I say. I'm willing to look at it, and look at opposing views, and move on. I think I'm right in not jumping on the "fire Ty" bandwagon. I may be wrong. Would you prefer I didn't voice my opinion? Would you be happy with a "Hell yeah, fire Ty" even though the Jazz are doing better than most experts predicted? (Go back to pre-season predictions, and you'll see the Jazz are doing better than predicted.)

Saint, first I hope you know I never take anything on here personal. Its all just talk, that is for fun.
Second, I used "bullshit" because you said a few things were "bs". I dont mean it in a negative way at all. I mean it as in, here is a place where we Jazz fans, a few Lakers fans, and a Raptors fan can come on here and post our own opinions and thoughts that matter to anyone or about anything other than just blabbing our mouths. You know, bullshitting. But I meant it in a good way. I love having this forum to go to and talk about my all time favorite team for any sport at any time.

And you probably know me well enough on here, that I love disagreements. I think thats the whole point of this site.

And hey, you dont want to jump on the Fire Ty bandwagon, great. Of course you dont have to. But as for where that is concerned, it's true. The Jazz have been underrated in the preseason I think every year of my last 20+ years of being a fan. So that is no different. However, just because they weren't picked to do all that well, does not mean IMO that we should settle for mediocre. Ty has had options for better players, and better combinations. And it's not just me, it's ESPN writers, NBA websites, Hoopsworld, SI.com, David Locke, Trib/Desnews writers. All of them. Tyrone Corbin has an addiction to offense, and it sinks this team, continues to. This team would have done better than the team last year, had Corbin made some of the changes he's finally done now, months ago. When me and others were saying it.

Btw, I've been screaming for DC3 since LAST years playoffs. And the Hornets game the other night was yet another example of what he does for this team. He DOES change this team and games. I promise you that.
Back to top Go down
View user profile
TheMagnus
Admin
avatar

Posts : 1765
Points : 2172
Reputation : 75
Join date : 2012-04-26

PostSubject: Re: Change.org Fire Coach T   Tue Apr 09, 2013 12:42 pm

Interesting endorsement from Coach Corbin from Ettore Messina, one of the most respected Coaches in Europe....

Quote :

"There are many really good coaches in the NBA. It was an honor to work with Mike Brown, who is an excellent coach. I saw many good coaches and not only on the top-level teams. Some coaches don't have a big name for themselves, but did a great job organizing their team. I really liked Monty Williams of the Hornets and coach Corbin of the Jazz, who carried the Sloan legacy."

http://www.nba.com/global/the_euroblog_2013.html#130408-messina
Back to top Go down
View user profile
zero24gravity
Admin
avatar

Posts : 1137
Points : 1423
Reputation : 47
Join date : 2012-04-27
Age : 39

PostSubject: Re: Change.org Fire Coach T   Tue Apr 09, 2013 1:30 pm

TheMagnus wrote:
Interesting endorsement from Coach Corbin from Ettore Messina, one of the most respected Coaches in Europe....

Quote :

"There are many really good coaches in the NBA. It was an honor to work with Mike Brown, who is an excellent coach. I saw many good coaches and not only on the top-level teams. Some coaches don't have a big name for themselves, but did a great job organizing their team. I really liked Monty Williams of the Hornets and coach Corbin of the Jazz, who carried the Sloan legacy."

http://www.nba.com/global/the_euroblog_2013.html#130408-messina

Well, he also said that Mike Brown is an excellent coach, so his judgment has to be questioned. Razz
Yes, Brown's W/L record is good, but he simply relied on LBJ for wins in CLE & totally lost control of the Lakers. (Which, I will admit was a tough job to go in to, even with all the talent they have on paper.) Since the LAL job though, I haven't heard anything about him being in the converstaion for any other jobs.
Back to top Go down
View user profile http://www.facebook.com/BasketAppealGiftBaskets
Romoholic
Admin
avatar

Posts : 1090
Points : 1284
Reputation : 38
Join date : 2012-04-26
Age : 42
Location : Layton, Utah

PostSubject: Re: Change.org Fire Coach T   Wed Apr 10, 2013 10:29 am

Saint Louis wrote:
Romoholic wrote:
Mutangclan wrote:
Saint Louis wrote:
Mutangclan wrote:
You boys and girls forward this to all your friends. Again, dont kid myself that I think Rigby/KOC/Lindsey will look at this at all, but it is the only thing out there with a Jazz Fans voice.

MuTang, you know I've backed you up many times in the past. But, your fire Corbin campaign has gone completely off-base and has no merits other than pathetic echoes by smaller minds with internet access.

I've listened patiently as you and others have continually posted about how Burks and DC are the answers to all the Jazz' woes. I haven't wanted to say too much because I have high hopes for DC and Burks. But, give me a f-ing break-- DC and Burks both are high-energy low talent players that probably would not get a chance to play on any playoff-bound team. We're a middle of the road team, and DC and Burks are at best middle of the road 2nd stringers.

Mu Tang (and others), you have completely lost perspective in your hatred of Ty and how you look at Jazz games. As a PG, Burks is probably our 4th best option. As a SG, Burks is behind Heyhay, Foye, and DC (not to mention Mo at the SG). As a SG/SF swing, DC is behind Heyhay and Foye, and, IMO, Marvin Williams. I'm not saying Burks and DC are useless-- but, Burks rarely merits playing time, and DC SHOULD get more emergency play at the sg/sf position.

With the most recent criticisms of how Ty coached our team against Denver, it is easy for me to see how myopic (short-sighted, unable to see the big picture) you (Mu) and others are when looking at Jazz games. There were no complaints about the Jazz in the first half. No one mentioned how badly the Jazz were outmatched once Corey Brewer came in for Denver's 2nd unit. We all love Heyhay, but, Brewer came in fresh and tore him apart.

Then, as everyone on this site seems to agree, the Jazz went from a team equal to Denver to a sub-par team at the beginning of the 3rd quarter.. The Jazz starters of Mo Williams, Randy Foye, Gordan Hayward, Paul Millsap, and Al Jefferson gave away eight straight points to the Nugs. But, let's look at what happened. We started with a possession and Millsap missed on a pretty good look. Koufos rebounded, but, we played good defense and got a steal (by Foye). Then Heyhay missed an open 3pt shot and Koufos rebounded. We played good defense and Big Al got the rebound. We moved the ball around on offense, then Mo took it to the rim and was blocked by Koufos, who also got the rebound. We played good defense and Millsap got the rebound. Then, Heyhay missed another open shot and Koufos got the rebound. We played pretty good defense, but with two seconds left on the shot clock Iguadala nailed a lucky 3pt shot. Two minutes into the 3rd quarter and Denver breaks the defensive tie. Now, this is the point where
Denver is about to break lose, or, this is where the Jazz simply answer a 3-0 two minutes with a basket to make it 3-2 for the first 3 minutes of the 3rd quarter. Foye misses a desperation 3pt shot with one second left on the shot clock and Faried gets the defensive rebound. 13 seconds later Gallinari beats Heyhay to the hoop and makes a lay-up-- Foye fouls him too late to stop the shot from going in. He makes the free throw. IS THIS WHERE TY SHOULD HAVE TAKEN OUT OUR STARTERS? And if Ty takes anyone out, who should it be? Mo is distributing well on offense, but no one is hitting their open shots. Mo has played solid defense so far in the 3rd quarter, so there is no reason to take him out. Foye is actually playing great defense, and, aside from missing a desperation three, he has done nothing wrong. Heyhay has missed some open looks and is getting destroyed by Denver's Gallinari/Iguadala combo. (But, Heyward is really one of our best players, so, how the hell can we take HIM out?) Millsap has completely neutralized his opponent, and, his opponent has completely neutralized Millsap. Big Al hasn't taken a shot yet in the 3rd quarter, and that MUST be confusing for someone who most every expert in NBA analysis says is one of the best 15 players in the entire NBA. SO, IF TY MAKES ANY CHANGES, WHAT ARE THEY? Ty doesn't take a timeout, and Mo ends up taking another desperation 3, which misses, and 23 seconds later Iguadal beats Heyhay to the rim for a dunk-- that's eight points in a row for Denver, and they all came from Iguadala and Gallineri. Heyhay is getting burned left and right. IT'S AN 8-0 RUN 4 MINUTES INTO THE 3RD QUARTER! WHAT SHOULD TY DO?

An 8-0 run over 4 minutes is not really something any NBA coach should worry too much about. The opponents getting 8 pts in a 4 minute span is completely acceptable. What IS worth worrying about is the complete lack of scoring. And, at this point in the game, the Jazz already have their best scorers on the floor. They need a change in mind-sets, and possible personnel! At this point the Jazz players played better. Foye and Jefferson became very active offensively. They made some and missed some. But Faried abused Millsap on the offensive end. Millsap finally got to the rim and was fouled, to make two free throws, but TY decided Favors was a better matchup at PF, and pulled Millsap. This actually worked until Denver inserted Corey Brewer back into the game.

When Corey Brewer re-entered the game shortly into the 4th quarter, the Nuggets were on cruise control. Imagine the world's best janitor asked to clean up a mess with only 4 co-workers. Brewer barely did anything remarkable in the 4th quarter He just cleaned it up and made sure everyone punched the clock. Blame Ty if you want-- but, I don't think anyone on this site could have coached the Jazz more efficiently. I really think this whole "Fire Ty" campaign is complete bullshit, driven by desires that are not entirely rooted in reality. Sorry, forumotioners-- I ain't with you on this one.

Interesting. Lets point out the elephant in the room first: This entire forum is BULLSHIT. All this stuff we talk about is bullshit, all of our opinions on here are bullshit, all of our arguments our bullshit, the "better ways" to manage the team on here are bullshit. AND THAT IS THE POINT OF IT, correct?


Hey I resemble that statement!

Quite the finger pointing there guy. But one thing to point out first. It was not my petition, someone else started it, I just found it and passed it on. But for you to come on here and blast away, calling other fans and their opinions "small minds", is a bit much. Maybe come down off that horse for a second. They're opinions, nothing more, nothing less. And your opinion is no better than those "small minded" folks, no better than mine. Shoot, it isn't even better than Calgary's.

It's also very interesting that you're so serious about a petition that I have more than once pointed out that I fully well know is not going anywhere and is just a fun thing to dream about. There is no way in hell the Jazz front office is going to see it, and even if they did, there is no way in hell they would give it a second thought. And I've repeated that since it came on here.

I'm a Jazz fan, and a frustrated fan at that. If you dont like fans expressing their opinions, emotional or not, that too bad for you pally. Thats the entire point of this forum. The most interesting part of it all, is that you can come on here and tell me that I've completely lost perspective on the team that I watch every game of, and that my opinion of Burks and DC is completely WRONG. But I have news for you, if you actually do believe that Burks and DC are low talent players that dont help a team immensely, then you dont know nearly as much as you seem to think you do.

The other part of that is I NEVER said DC and Burks were the answer to all the teams woe's. I've said that Corbin should play the players that give the team the best chance to win. THAT IS ALL. I'm not making out to be more than they are. Oh, and not coincidentally, the numbers show that I am right. (and since I dont carry as much weight around here, Magnus also has felt the same.)

If you think that Burks is our fourth best option at PG, then you are coming across as someone who is not very knowledgeable of the game.
We actually say that Burks was the second best option at PG while Mo was out

Funny, lumping me into the Denver game talk. I believe all I said was "nice rotations Tyrone". That was it. But calling me shortsighted and unable to see the big picture.....hmmmm. Interesting. Somebody really needs to slow their roll, eh?

I have been consistent all year long, that there needs to be a balance to the starting and second units. Been a broken record. And since Al/Mo are two of the worst defenders going, we need IN MY OPINION, to have other good defenders on the court. Also, very few disagree that Foye is not a starting type player, that he is best suited as a hired gun off the bench. He also is not a very good defender. DC fills this roll perfectly and balance's out the first unit. And Foye coming off the bench, also balances out the 2nd unit as a scorer that is now needed with Gordon starting.
Lastly, Tinsely and Watson should never play. It's not opinion, its fact backed up by numbers, statistics, and knowledge of watching the game. It's best for the team now, in the future, and to win games if Burks plays the back up PG. Thats NOT opinion.

Very interesting that you come on here posting as if you are right in all your assessments, and everyone else is wrong. That only you can see the big picture, but I can't....very interesting.......Im sorry you are so bothered by other peoples opinions on a site developed to have opinions posted. But just because you have opinions on others, and the Jazz, doesn't mean you're right.






Honestly though saint louis, it's not cool to come on here and start name calling and shit because you don't agree with other people's opinions.

I actually went and signed the petition, because while i think it's a little pointless, I do think that Jazz management needs to know that the fans are very unhappy with the Job Corbin is doing! I can guarantee they know the petition is out there, cause I tweeted the link to Greg Miller.

The simple fact is that it's not just a few disgruntled Jazz fans that are bashing Ty. A lot of the national media is seeing it and it's being talked about in NBA circles. I listen to internet radio all day and hear it brought up pretty often.

I appreciate your response when you say, "Honestly though saint louis, it's not cool to come on here and start name calling and shit because you don't agree with other people's opinions." YOU ARE NOT AT ALL A MORON. I don't have much of a reference, though, for your accuracy on what is "cool" and what is not cool. Miles Davis. Is Miles Davis cool?

I do hope, though, that MuTang was wrong when he said that this site was created so everyone could post BULLSHIT. I have higher hopes for this site. I hope you do as well.

I'm not calling anyone on this site a complete pissant, or, even a knee-jerk reactionary ass-wipe. I think Jazz fans on and off this site are smarter than most basketball fans. If I bother to disagree with a Jazz fan, you better believe it's out of respect. I would not bother to respond to someone I thought was idiotic. I DO apalogize for using the phrase "small minds" referring to the posters I didn't feel merited a response-- they are not small-minded-- it just seemed to me they were jumping on a bad bandwagon without much more than the momentum already presented.

So, cool or not, I'll continue to post-- unless you don't want to hear it. And, if you don't want to hear it... well, I won't object too much. There's a possibility I'm wrong about everything I say. I'm willing to look at it, and look at opposing views, and move on. I think I'm right in not jumping on the "fire Ty" bandwagon. I may be wrong. Would you prefer I didn't voice my opinion? Would you be happy with a "Hell yeah, fire Ty" even though the Jazz are doing better than most experts predicted? (Go back to pre-season predictions, and you'll see the Jazz are doing better than predicted.)

Me saying it's not cool, is just a nice way of saying quit being a dickhead. I have no preference on you voicing your opinion or not, so that's your call.

_________________
Back to top Go down
View user profile http://jazznation.forumotion.com
Saint Louis
Starter


Posts : 382
Points : 473
Reputation : 8
Join date : 2012-04-28

PostSubject: Re: Change.org Fire Coach T   Thu Apr 11, 2013 12:58 am

Romoholic wrote:
Saint Louis wrote:
Romoholic wrote:
Mutangclan wrote:
Saint Louis wrote:
Mutangclan wrote:
You boys and girls forward this to all your friends. Again, dont kid myself that I think Rigby/KOC/Lindsey will look at this at all, but it is the only thing out there with a Jazz Fans voice.

MuTang, you know I've backed you up many times in the past. But, your fire Corbin campaign has gone completely off-base and has no merits other than pathetic echoes by smaller minds with internet access.

I've listened patiently as you and others have continually posted about how Burks and DC are the answers to all the Jazz' woes. I haven't wanted to say too much because I have high hopes for DC and Burks. But, give me a f-ing break-- DC and Burks both are high-energy low talent players that probably would not get a chance to play on any playoff-bound team. We're a middle of the road team, and DC and Burks are at best middle of the road 2nd stringers.

Mu Tang (and others), you have completely lost perspective in your hatred of Ty and how you look at Jazz games. As a PG, Burks is probably our 4th best option. As a SG, Burks is behind Heyhay, Foye, and DC (not to mention Mo at the SG). As a SG/SF swing, DC is behind Heyhay and Foye, and, IMO, Marvin Williams. I'm not saying Burks and DC are useless-- but, Burks rarely merits playing time, and DC SHOULD get more emergency play at the sg/sf position.

With the most recent criticisms of how Ty coached our team against Denver, it is easy for me to see how myopic (short-sighted, unable to see the big picture) you (Mu) and others are when looking at Jazz games. There were no complaints about the Jazz in the first half. No one mentioned how badly the Jazz were outmatched once Corey Brewer came in for Denver's 2nd unit. We all love Heyhay, but, Brewer came in fresh and tore him apart.

Then, as everyone on this site seems to agree, the Jazz went from a team equal to Denver to a sub-par team at the beginning of the 3rd quarter.. The Jazz starters of Mo Williams, Randy Foye, Gordan Hayward, Paul Millsap, and Al Jefferson gave away eight straight points to the Nugs. But, let's look at what happened. We started with a possession and Millsap missed on a pretty good look. Koufos rebounded, but, we played good defense and got a steal (by Foye). Then Heyhay missed an open 3pt shot and Koufos rebounded. We played good defense and Big Al got the rebound. We moved the ball around on offense, then Mo took it to the rim and was blocked by Koufos, who also got the rebound. We played good defense and Millsap got the rebound. Then, Heyhay missed another open shot and Koufos got the rebound. We played pretty good defense, but with two seconds left on the shot clock Iguadala nailed a lucky 3pt shot. Two minutes into the 3rd quarter and Denver breaks the defensive tie. Now, this is the point where
Denver is about to break lose, or, this is where the Jazz simply answer a 3-0 two minutes with a basket to make it 3-2 for the first 3 minutes of the 3rd quarter. Foye misses a desperation 3pt shot with one second left on the shot clock and Faried gets the defensive rebound. 13 seconds later Gallinari beats Heyhay to the hoop and makes a lay-up-- Foye fouls him too late to stop the shot from going in. He makes the free throw. IS THIS WHERE TY SHOULD HAVE TAKEN OUT OUR STARTERS? And if Ty takes anyone out, who should it be? Mo is distributing well on offense, but no one is hitting their open shots. Mo has played solid defense so far in the 3rd quarter, so there is no reason to take him out. Foye is actually playing great defense, and, aside from missing a desperation three, he has done nothing wrong. Heyhay has missed some open looks and is getting destroyed by Denver's Gallinari/Iguadala combo. (But, Heyward is really one of our best players, so, how the hell can we take HIM out?) Millsap has completely neutralized his opponent, and, his opponent has completely neutralized Millsap. Big Al hasn't taken a shot yet in the 3rd quarter, and that MUST be confusing for someone who most every expert in NBA analysis says is one of the best 15 players in the entire NBA. SO, IF TY MAKES ANY CHANGES, WHAT ARE THEY? Ty doesn't take a timeout, and Mo ends up taking another desperation 3, which misses, and 23 seconds later Iguadal beats Heyhay to the rim for a dunk-- that's eight points in a row for Denver, and they all came from Iguadala and Gallineri. Heyhay is getting burned left and right. IT'S AN 8-0 RUN 4 MINUTES INTO THE 3RD QUARTER! WHAT SHOULD TY DO?

An 8-0 run over 4 minutes is not really something any NBA coach should worry too much about. The opponents getting 8 pts in a 4 minute span is completely acceptable. What IS worth worrying about is the complete lack of scoring. And, at this point in the game, the Jazz already have their best scorers on the floor. They need a change in mind-sets, and possible personnel! At this point the Jazz players played better. Foye and Jefferson became very active offensively. They made some and missed some. But Faried abused Millsap on the offensive end. Millsap finally got to the rim and was fouled, to make two free throws, but TY decided Favors was a better matchup at PF, and pulled Millsap. This actually worked until Denver inserted Corey Brewer back into the game.

When Corey Brewer re-entered the game shortly into the 4th quarter, the Nuggets were on cruise control. Imagine the world's best janitor asked to clean up a mess with only 4 co-workers. Brewer barely did anything remarkable in the 4th quarter He just cleaned it up and made sure everyone punched the clock. Blame Ty if you want-- but, I don't think anyone on this site could have coached the Jazz more efficiently. I really think this whole "Fire Ty" campaign is complete bullshit, driven by desires that are not entirely rooted in reality. Sorry, forumotioners-- I ain't with you on this one.

Interesting. Lets point out the elephant in the room first: This entire forum is BULLSHIT. All this stuff we talk about is bullshit, all of our opinions on here are bullshit, all of our arguments our bullshit, the "better ways" to manage the team on here are bullshit. AND THAT IS THE POINT OF IT, correct?


Hey I resemble that statement!

Quite the finger pointing there guy. But one thing to point out first. It was not my petition, someone else started it, I just found it and passed it on. But for you to come on here and blast away, calling other fans and their opinions "small minds", is a bit much. Maybe come down off that horse for a second. They're opinions, nothing more, nothing less. And your opinion is no better than those "small minded" folks, no better than mine. Shoot, it isn't even better than Calgary's.

It's also very interesting that you're so serious about a petition that I have more than once pointed out that I fully well know is not going anywhere and is just a fun thing to dream about. There is no way in hell the Jazz front office is going to see it, and even if they did, there is no way in hell they would give it a second thought. And I've repeated that since it came on here.

I'm a Jazz fan, and a frustrated fan at that. If you dont like fans expressing their opinions, emotional or not, that too bad for you pally. Thats the entire point of this forum. The most interesting part of it all, is that you can come on here and tell me that I've completely lost perspective on the team that I watch every game of, and that my opinion of Burks and DC is completely WRONG. But I have news for you, if you actually do believe that Burks and DC are low talent players that dont help a team immensely, then you dont know nearly as much as you seem to think you do.

The other part of that is I NEVER said DC and Burks were the answer to all the teams woe's. I've said that Corbin should play the players that give the team the best chance to win. THAT IS ALL. I'm not making out to be more than they are. Oh, and not coincidentally, the numbers show that I am right. (and since I dont carry as much weight around here, Magnus also has felt the same.)

If you think that Burks is our fourth best option at PG, then you are coming across as someone who is not very knowledgeable of the game.
We actually say that Burks was the second best option at PG while Mo was out

Funny, lumping me into the Denver game talk. I believe all I said was "nice rotations Tyrone". That was it. But calling me shortsighted and unable to see the big picture.....hmmmm. Interesting. Somebody really needs to slow their roll, eh?

I have been consistent all year long, that there needs to be a balance to the starting and second units. Been a broken record. And since Al/Mo are two of the worst defenders going, we need IN MY OPINION, to have other good defenders on the court. Also, very few disagree that Foye is not a starting type player, that he is best suited as a hired gun off the bench. He also is not a very good defender. DC fills this roll perfectly and balance's out the first unit. And Foye coming off the bench, also balances out the 2nd unit as a scorer that is now needed with Gordon starting.
Lastly, Tinsely and Watson should never play. It's not opinion, its fact backed up by numbers, statistics, and knowledge of watching the game. It's best for the team now, in the future, and to win games if Burks plays the back up PG. Thats NOT opinion.

Very interesting that you come on here posting as if you are right in all your assessments, and everyone else is wrong. That only you can see the big picture, but I can't....very interesting.......Im sorry you are so bothered by other peoples opinions on a site developed to have opinions posted. But just because you have opinions on others, and the Jazz, doesn't mean you're right.






Honestly though saint louis, it's not cool to come on here and start name calling and shit because you don't agree with other people's opinions.

I actually went and signed the petition, because while i think it's a little pointless, I do think that Jazz management needs to know that the fans are very unhappy with the Job Corbin is doing! I can guarantee they know the petition is out there, cause I tweeted the link to Greg Miller.

The simple fact is that it's not just a few disgruntled Jazz fans that are bashing Ty. A lot of the national media is seeing it and it's being talked about in NBA circles. I listen to internet radio all day and hear it brought up pretty often.

I appreciate your response when you say, "Honestly though saint louis, it's not cool to come on here and start name calling and shit because you don't agree with other people's opinions." YOU ARE NOT AT ALL A MORON. I don't have much of a reference, though, for your accuracy on what is "cool" and what is not cool. Miles Davis. Is Miles Davis cool?

I do hope, though, that MuTang was wrong when he said that this site was created so everyone could post BULLSHIT. I have higher hopes for this site. I hope you do as well.

I'm not calling anyone on this site a complete pissant, or, even a knee-jerk reactionary ass-wipe. I think Jazz fans on and off this site are smarter than most basketball fans. If I bother to disagree with a Jazz fan, you better believe it's out of respect. I would not bother to respond to someone I thought was idiotic. I DO apalogize for using the phrase "small minds" referring to the posters I didn't feel merited a response-- they are not small-minded-- it just seemed to me they were jumping on a bad bandwagon without much more than the momentum already presented.

So, cool or not, I'll continue to post-- unless you don't want to hear it. And, if you don't want to hear it... well, I won't object too much. There's a possibility I'm wrong about everything I say. I'm willing to look at it, and look at opposing views, and move on. I think I'm right in not jumping on the "fire Ty" bandwagon. I may be wrong. Would you prefer I didn't voice my opinion? Would you be happy with a "Hell yeah, fire Ty" even though the Jazz are doing better than most experts predicted? (Go back to pre-season predictions, and you'll see the Jazz are doing better than predicted.)

Me saying it's not cool, is just a nice way of saying quit being a dickhead. I have no preference on you voicing your opinion or not, so that's your call.

Didn't mean to be a dickhead (most people don't want to be a dickhead, and I'm with that group).

I try to be objective with what I say. I don't mean to hurt anyone's feelings when I post on here. I have quite a bit of respect for the people that post on this thread. Apparently, my posts made you feel I was being a dickhead. Sorry. All I can say in my defense is that I wouldn't bother responding to any of the posts on this site if I didn't have a certain amount of respect for the other posters.

With this "Fire Ty" landslide, I've felt people posting are jumping on a bandwagon that has constantly been reinforced by constant posting with the idea of promoting the movement of getting Ty fired. And, I think this movement continually ignores anything that happens in the real world that counters the sentiment of the movement. It's like watching Fox News editorials that are presented as news. When I watch a Jazz game, I come away with my own conclusions. When I log on to this site and see a landslide of opinions being expressed that don't agree with how I saw the game, I express my opinion. If my opinion doesn't match the overwhelming opinions of people posting on this site-- does that make me a dickhead? I've given honest analysis on what I've seen. If you don't want to hear it, well, that's sad for both/all of us.
Back to top Go down
View user profile
Mutangclan
Hall Of Famer
avatar

Posts : 1296
Points : 1397
Reputation : 73
Join date : 2012-04-26

PostSubject: Re: Change.org Fire Coach T   Thu Apr 11, 2013 7:55 am

Saint Louis wrote:

With this "Fire Ty" landslide, I've felt people posting are jumping on a bandwagon that has constantly been reinforced by constant posting with the idea of promoting the movement of getting Ty fired. And, I think this movement continually ignores anything that happens in the real world that counters the sentiment of the movement. It's like watching Fox News editorials that are presented as news. When I watch a Jazz game, I come away with my own conclusions. When I log on to this site and see a landslide of opinions being expressed that don't agree with how I saw the game, I express my opinion. If my opinion doesn't match the overwhelming opinions of people posting on this site-- does that make me a dickhead? I've given honest analysis on what I've seen. If you don't want to hear it, well, that's sad for both/all of us.

I dont think your a dickhead Saint Very Happy I think you came across as an angry know-it-all on that one post, but I think you have great opinions, whether I agree or not cheers

And I'd agree with some people, just jumping behind a burn him at the stake mob. However, it still doesn't change what I believe to be fact: Ty Corbin, with his either lack of knowledge, or more likely stubborn resistance to playing the players that would have made a difference, has put us in a position where we now most likely will miss the playoffs. It was not a winning philosophy, and the changes he finally made that I and others pleaded for, are too little too late. Had he gone with a TON more DC, more Burks, more Gordo, more Kanter, more Paul, less Al, less Foye, less Watson/Tinsley etc, that would of given us at least 4 or more victories. That puts us in the 6th position and sitting pretty!! SIXTH POSITION man....sad sad sad.

Instead, we all hold our breath and sadly are more and more impressed by Slobe's non-stop motor and refusal to be wrong about his prediction. I can't stand him as a person and player, but what he's doing right now, at his age is one of the most impressive things I've ever seen.

There was no reason, NO REASON for this team to be worse than last year. Everyone on this team was better, only Corbin was worse. And he made the decisions, so here we sit. And in case people dont remember, I'm not always a bash the coach guy. Normally, it falls on the players to execute, do their jobs etc. Tyrone isn't even putting this team in a position to succeed.
I was a Jerry fan, but didn't love everything he did. And voiced it.
Back to top Go down
View user profile
Romoholic
Admin
avatar

Posts : 1090
Points : 1284
Reputation : 38
Join date : 2012-04-26
Age : 42
Location : Layton, Utah

PostSubject: Re: Change.org Fire Coach T   Thu Apr 11, 2013 8:52 am

Mutangclan wrote:
Saint Louis wrote:

With this "Fire Ty" landslide, I've felt people posting are jumping on a bandwagon that has constantly been reinforced by constant posting with the idea of promoting the movement of getting Ty fired. And, I think this movement continually ignores anything that happens in the real world that counters the sentiment of the movement. It's like watching Fox News editorials that are presented as news. When I watch a Jazz game, I come away with my own conclusions. When I log on to this site and see a landslide of opinions being expressed that don't agree with how I saw the game, I express my opinion. If my opinion doesn't match the overwhelming opinions of people posting on this site-- does that make me a dickhead? I've given honest analysis on what I've seen. If you don't want to hear it, well, that's sad for both/all of us.

I dont think your a dickhead Saint Very Happy I think you came across as an angry know-it-all on that one post, but I think you have great opinions, whether I agree or not cheers

And I'd agree with some people, just jumping behind a burn him at the stake mob. However, it still doesn't change what I believe to be fact: Ty Corbin, with his either lack of knowledge, or more likely stubborn resistance to playing the players that would have made a difference, has put us in a position where we now most likely will miss the playoffs. It was not a winning philosophy, and the changes he finally made that I and others pleaded for, are too little too late. Had he gone with a TON more DC, more Burks, more Gordo, more Kanter, more Paul, less Al, less Foye, less Watson/Tinsley etc, that would of given us at least 4 or more victories. That puts us in the 6th position and sitting pretty!! SIXTH POSITION man....sad sad sad.

Instead, we all hold our breath and sadly are more and more impressed by Slobe's non-stop motor and refusal to be wrong about his prediction. I can't stand him as a person and player, but what he's doing right now, at his age is one of the most impressive things I've ever seen.

There was no reason, NO REASON for this team to be worse than last year. Everyone on this team was better, only Corbin was worse. And he made the decisions, so here we sit. And in case people dont remember, I'm not always a bash the coach guy. Normally, it falls on the players to execute, do their jobs etc. Tyrone isn't even putting this team in a position to succeed.
I was a Jerry fan, but didn't love everything he did. And voiced it.

While I don't think Corbin has been very good this season. I think some of the blame has to go to the front office as well. Marvin and Foye were not good pick ups. Yeah Randy will go off every 5-6 games but is a liability on d and relies too much on the three point shot, when I know for a fact that he has more to his game, I've seen it in the past. Marvin is exactly who he was with the hawks. Keeping Harris would have given us a very solid pg rotation and would have not taken minutes away from guys that Marvin is getting. Also not moving Al or Paul has caused a log jam and I can understand why Corbin plays them as much as he does. It's pretty common to play talented vets over young guys with potential. So I have to blame KOC as much as Corbin for this lost season.

And yeah you're cool Saint, just had one post where you came out blasting pretty much everyone on this forum.

_________________
Back to top Go down
View user profile http://jazznation.forumotion.com
TheMagnus
Admin
avatar

Posts : 1765
Points : 2172
Reputation : 75
Join date : 2012-04-26

PostSubject: Re: Change.org Fire Coach T   Thu Apr 11, 2013 9:14 am

Romoholic wrote:
Mutangclan wrote:
Saint Louis wrote:

With this "Fire Ty" landslide, I've felt people posting are jumping on a bandwagon that has constantly been reinforced by constant posting with the idea of promoting the movement of getting Ty fired. And, I think this movement continually ignores anything that happens in the real world that counters the sentiment of the movement. It's like watching Fox News editorials that are presented as news. When I watch a Jazz game, I come away with my own conclusions. When I log on to this site and see a landslide of opinions being expressed that don't agree with how I saw the game, I express my opinion. If my opinion doesn't match the overwhelming opinions of people posting on this site-- does that make me a dickhead? I've given honest analysis on what I've seen. If you don't want to hear it, well, that's sad for both/all of us.

I dont think your a dickhead Saint Very Happy I think you came across as an angry know-it-all on that one post, but I think you have great opinions, whether I agree or not cheers

And I'd agree with some people, just jumping behind a burn him at the stake mob. However, it still doesn't change what I believe to be fact: Ty Corbin, with his either lack of knowledge, or more likely stubborn resistance to playing the players that would have made a difference, has put us in a position where we now most likely will miss the playoffs. It was not a winning philosophy, and the changes he finally made that I and others pleaded for, are too little too late. Had he gone with a TON more DC, more Burks, more Gordo, more Kanter, more Paul, less Al, less Foye, less Watson/Tinsley etc, that would of given us at least 4 or more victories. That puts us in the 6th position and sitting pretty!! SIXTH POSITION man....sad sad sad.

Instead, we all hold our breath and sadly are more and more impressed by Slobe's non-stop motor and refusal to be wrong about his prediction. I can't stand him as a person and player, but what he's doing right now, at his age is one of the most impressive things I've ever seen.

There was no reason, NO REASON for this team to be worse than last year. Everyone on this team was better, only Corbin was worse. And he made the decisions, so here we sit. And in case people dont remember, I'm not always a bash the coach guy. Normally, it falls on the players to execute, do their jobs etc. Tyrone isn't even putting this team in a position to succeed.
I was a Jerry fan, but didn't love everything he did. And voiced it.

While I don't think Corbin has been very good this season. I think some of the blame has to go to the front office as well. Marvin and Foye were not good pick ups. Yeah Randy will go off every 5-6 games but is a liability on d and relies too much on the three point shot, when I know for a fact that he has more to his game, I've seen it in the past. Marvin is exactly who he was with the hawks. Keeping Harris would have given us a very solid pg rotation and would have not taken minutes away from guys that Marvin is getting. Also not moving Al or Paul has caused a log jam and I can understand why Corbin plays them as much as he does. It's pretty common to play talented vets over young guys with potential. So I have to blame KOC as much as Corbin for this lost season.

And yeah you're cool Saint, just had one post where you came out blasting pretty much everyone on this forum.

While I agree that the Front office bears some of the blame for their moves, or lack thereof, as you mentioned, but there are a couple of things you mentioned that fall pretty squarely on Corbin, the biggest ones being the way Marvin have Foye have been used on this team.

If Marvin was exactly who he was with the Hawks all season I think we'd all be overjoyed but he has been worse, much worse, and it was only after Marvin was moved back to the bench that he went back to being more like Hawks Marvin. He was badly missused by Corbin who tried to turn him into a spot up shooter and moved him out to the perimeter more and it was a disaster, that's not his game, and it took Corbin 3/4 of the season to fix that.

Foye is only making 2.3 million this year, and he's giving pretty much what we should have expected. He's not a starting quality player and he wasn't signed to be a starting quality player, he was signed to give the Jazz what they deperately needed last year, outside shooting, and he has easily delivered 2.3 million worth of that. Foye is a long range gunner that plays passable D, but has been forced into a starters role by Corbin. I feel like Corbin relied on him too much, especialy with a first unit that clearly wasn't working, and has failed to establish him in a role that is best for both him and the team.
Back to top Go down
View user profile
Mutangclan
Hall Of Famer
avatar

Posts : 1296
Points : 1397
Reputation : 73
Join date : 2012-04-26

PostSubject: Re: Change.org Fire Coach T   Thu Apr 11, 2013 9:51 am

TheMagnus wrote:


While I agree that the Front office bears some of the blame for their moves, or lack thereof, as you mentioned, but there are a couple of things you mentioned that fall pretty squarely on Corbin, the biggest ones being the way Marvin have Foye have been used on this team.

If Marvin was exactly who he was with the Hawks all season I think we'd all be overjoyed but he has been worse, much worse, and it was only after Marvin was moved back to the bench that he went back to being more like Hawks Marvin. He was badly missused by Corbin who tried to turn him into a spot up shooter and moved him out to the perimeter more and it was a disaster, that's not his game, and it took Corbin 3/4 of the season to fix that.

Foye is only making 2.3 million this year, and he's giving pretty much what we should have expected. He's not a starting quality player and he wasn't signed to be a starting quality player, he was signed to give the Jazz what they deperately needed last year, outside shooting, and he has easily delivered 2.3 million worth of that. Foye is a long range gunner that plays passable D, but has been forced into a starters role by Corbin. I feel like Corbin relied on him too much, especialy with a first unit that clearly wasn't working, and has failed to establish him in a role that is best for both him and the team.

EXACTLY my thoughts. Foye has been an off the bench scorer/shooter pretty much his whole career, so why the hell now is Corbin trying to make him a starter and a guy thats supposed to get his own shot?? It's stupid. Same way he keeps the same offense going when Fav is in for Al, it doesn't freaking make sense.

Marvin too. When he was signed, I for one talked about how good Marvin would be in an offense that moved, utilized his slashing, and put him in positions to score. Little did I know, he'd be forced to play with Al and made into something he's not.

And lets not forget, Lindsey and KOC both have said this year that coaching and rotations is all Corbin, so it actually is all his fault. And all this is Corbin's (IMO) idiot coaching. Not only wasn't it working, it didn't even make sense. Stubborn refusal is really what i think it was.......well, no wait, I think he is clueless. Well, actually, both. IDK!! Either way, get McMillan!!

PS: I think Tyrone FINALLY started listening to Hornacek, and thats the reason for the changes happening lately that are 3 months too late.
Back to top Go down
View user profile
Romoholic
Admin
avatar

Posts : 1090
Points : 1284
Reputation : 38
Join date : 2012-04-26
Age : 42
Location : Layton, Utah

PostSubject: Re: Change.org Fire Coach T   Thu Apr 11, 2013 10:13 am

TheMagnus wrote:
Romoholic wrote:
Mutangclan wrote:
Saint Louis wrote:

With this "Fire Ty" landslide, I've felt people posting are jumping on a bandwagon that has constantly been reinforced by constant posting with the idea of promoting the movement of getting Ty fired. And, I think this movement continually ignores anything that happens in the real world that counters the sentiment of the movement. It's like watching Fox News editorials that are presented as news. When I watch a Jazz game, I come away with my own conclusions. When I log on to this site and see a landslide of opinions being expressed that don't agree with how I saw the game, I express my opinion. If my opinion doesn't match the overwhelming opinions of people posting on this site-- does that make me a dickhead? I've given honest analysis on what I've seen. If you don't want to hear it, well, that's sad for both/all of us.

I dont think your a dickhead Saint Very Happy I think you came across as an angry know-it-all on that one post, but I think you have great opinions, whether I agree or not cheers

And I'd agree with some people, just jumping behind a burn him at the stake mob. However, it still doesn't change what I believe to be fact: Ty Corbin, with his either lack of knowledge, or more likely stubborn resistance to playing the players that would have made a difference, has put us in a position where we now most likely will miss the playoffs. It was not a winning philosophy, and the changes he finally made that I and others pleaded for, are too little too late. Had he gone with a TON more DC, more Burks, more Gordo, more Kanter, more Paul, less Al, less Foye, less Watson/Tinsley etc, that would of given us at least 4 or more victories. That puts us in the 6th position and sitting pretty!! SIXTH POSITION man....sad sad sad.

Instead, we all hold our breath and sadly are more and more impressed by Slobe's non-stop motor and refusal to be wrong about his prediction. I can't stand him as a person and player, but what he's doing right now, at his age is one of the most impressive things I've ever seen.

There was no reason, NO REASON for this team to be worse than last year. Everyone on this team was better, only Corbin was worse. And he made the decisions, so here we sit. And in case people dont remember, I'm not always a bash the coach guy. Normally, it falls on the players to execute, do their jobs etc. Tyrone isn't even putting this team in a position to succeed.
I was a Jerry fan, but didn't love everything he did. And voiced it.

While I don't think Corbin has been very good this season. I think some of the blame has to go to the front office as well. Marvin and Foye were not good pick ups. Yeah Randy will go off every 5-6 games but is a liability on d and relies too much on the three point shot, when I know for a fact that he has more to his game, I've seen it in the past. Marvin is exactly who he was with the hawks. Keeping Harris would have given us a very solid pg rotation and would have not taken minutes away from guys that Marvin is getting. Also not moving Al or Paul has caused a log jam and I can understand why Corbin plays them as much as he does. It's pretty common to play talented vets over young guys with potential. So I have to blame KOC as much as Corbin for this lost season.

And yeah you're cool Saint, just had one post where you came out blasting pretty much everyone on this forum.

While I agree that the Front office bears some of the blame for their moves, or lack thereof, as you mentioned, but there are a couple of things you mentioned that fall pretty squarely on Corbin, the biggest ones being the way Marvin have Foye have been used on this team.

If Marvin was exactly who he was with the Hawks all season I think we'd all be overjoyed but he has been worse, much worse, and it was only after Marvin was moved back to the bench that he went back to being more like Hawks Marvin. He was badly missused by Corbin who tried to turn him into a spot up shooter and moved him out to the perimeter more and it was a disaster, that's not his game, and it took Corbin 3/4 of the season to fix that.

Foye is only making 2.3 million this year, and he's giving pretty much what we should have expected. He's not a starting quality player and he wasn't signed to be a starting quality player, he was signed to give the Jazz what they deperately needed last year, outside shooting, and he has easily delivered 2.3 million worth of that. Foye is a long range gunner that plays passable D, but has been forced into a starters role by Corbin. I feel like Corbin relied on him too much, especialy with a first unit that clearly wasn't working, and has failed to establish him in a role that is best for both him and the team.

I actually like Randy, but you are right he shouldn't be starting, He needs to be used in more of a Kyle Korver role than a starter. When he starts and is off he shoots us right out of games, but Mo does that as often as Randy does. As far as Marvin, he was brought in to be a starter and almost no coach is going to bench a 8.5 million dollar player. DC is a much better option, but picks up DNPs at an alarming rate. I'm not defending Corbin, because I think he has done a horrible job, but the trade the front office made for Marvin is almost unforgivable. Just think how much more productive the back court of Mo and Harris would have been than what we have now! We have a borderline chucker starting and two guys you don't even have to defend backing him up. That is the biggest problem with this team!

_________________
Back to top Go down
View user profile http://jazznation.forumotion.com
Trollificus
All Star
avatar

Posts : 553
Points : 684
Reputation : 47
Join date : 2012-05-03
Age : 97
Location : Sugarhouse

PostSubject: Re: Change.org Fire Coach T   Thu Apr 11, 2013 10:29 am

Props for the "Largest Quote Pyramid, by Word Count" in the history of this board*, Saint.

As for the "To be, or not to be, a dickhead" question...there are gradations of sensitivity on the internet, from in(ternet)vulnerable, hide, rind, and thick-skinned, to thin-skinned, sensitive, thenthitive, exposed nerves and "pantspissing manbaby". Some people take offense, some don't care, some fire back...if you think you're seeing a minor sort of mob mentality, it's hard to express that without being a little offensive, but at the end of the day, ya gotta tell people what you see.

Sure, there has been a "torches and pitchforks" element in the criticism of Corbin...it's fun, and hard to avoid when people are seeing and expressing anger at the same things you are seeing. So in one regard, it's mob mentality and from another perspective, it's validation of what we are all seeing.

Ultimately, as Mu points out, our opinions and comments are irrelevant (or "bullshit"). Corbin WILL be back next year, and while there may be some rationale for his player usage patterns and rotations, they have been frustrating to watch, hence the (futile) expressions of discontent. I don't think anybody's going to live or die by whether he coaches here next year, but a lot of us are hoping he'll LEARN, and be more flexible when certain things aren't working.

*-this assertion, as all others made under this internet persona, is certified "100% fact free". It may be true and there may be hard evidence supporting it, but damned if I can be arsed to go find it. Oddly enough, all such assertions are made with complete and total confidence that they are correct. Go figger.
Back to top Go down
View user profile
Trollificus
All Star
avatar

Posts : 553
Points : 684
Reputation : 47
Join date : 2012-05-03
Age : 97
Location : Sugarhouse

PostSubject: Re: Change.org Fire Coach T   Thu Apr 11, 2013 10:52 am

Mutangclan wrote:
TheMagnus wrote:


While I agree that the Front office bears some of the blame for their moves, or lack thereof, as you mentioned, but there are a couple of things you mentioned that fall pretty squarely on Corbin, the biggest ones being the way Marvin have Foye have been used on this team.

If Marvin was exactly who he was with the Hawks all season I think we'd all be overjoyed but he has been worse, much worse, and it was only after Marvin was moved back to the bench that he went back to being more like Hawks Marvin. He was badly missused by Corbin who tried to turn him into a spot up shooter and moved him out to the perimeter more and it was a disaster, that's not his game, and it took Corbin 3/4 of the season to fix that.

Foye is only making 2.3 million this year, and he's giving pretty much what we should have expected. He's not a starting quality player and he wasn't signed to be a starting quality player, he was signed to give the Jazz what they deperately needed last year, outside shooting, and he has easily delivered 2.3 million worth of that. Foye is a long range gunner that plays passable D, but has been forced into a starters role by Corbin. I feel like Corbin relied on him too much, especialy with a first unit that clearly wasn't working, and has failed to establish him in a role that is best for both him and the team.

EXACTLY my thoughts. Foye has been an off the bench scorer/shooter pretty much his whole career, so why the hell now is Corbin trying to make him a starter and a guy thats supposed to get his own shot?? It's stupid. Same way he keeps the same offense going when Fav is in for Al, it doesn't freaking make sense.

Marvin too. When he was signed, I for one talked about how good Marvin would be in an offense that moved, utilized his slashing, and put him in positions to score. Little did I know, he'd be forced to play with Al and made into something he's not.

And lets not forget, Lindsey and KOC both have said this year that coaching and rotations is all Corbin, so it actually is all his fault. And all this is Corbin's (IMO) idiot coaching. Not only wasn't it working, it didn't even make sense. Stubborn refusal is really what i think it was.......well, no wait, I think he is clueless. Well, actually, both. IDK!! Either way, get McMillan!!

PS: I think Tyrone FINALLY started listening to Hornacek, and thats the reason for the changes happening lately that are 3 months too late.

And HERE, all pitchforks and torches and "FIRE HIM!!" sentiments aside, is where the dissatisfaction comes from-it wasn't long-term trends, or advanced metrics, or even wins/losses where the failure of certain lineups was obvious: IT WAS IN-GAME, GAME-AFTER-GAME RESULTS. We called it "starting slow" when we found ourselves down 8 minutes into every game. But what do you call it, when, after the subs rally the team back by the half, WE FIND OURSELVES, GAME AFTER GAME, DOWN AGAIN 8 MINUTES INTO THE THIRD?? "Starting slowly" again?? No, it was the Watsley/OFF/Marvin/Paul/AL lineup that wasn't getting it done.

Corbin clearly has an idea of how that lineup should work, but IT WASN'T WORKING. And he stuck with it waaaay beyond the point it had become obvious to us, and to media observers (not-paid-by-the-team observers, anyway), and eventually (after those "Three scoreless starters?? REALLY?" games), by some in the national media, that it wasn't.

I've never been a "blame the coach" guy. I'm not a player worshipper. Usually, when teams underachieve, it's because the players are...well, underachieving. But I'm convinced we have a team of guys who are going out there and trying their best, and if the sum is less than the parts, it has to do with players' games not meshing (not 'chemistry', I think these guys get along and respect each other).

I don't care if Corbin ever fully understands why those combinations didn't work, I just want him to learn to respect the results and make changes. Hell, I found the results appallingly at odds with the ability of the players, and I don't claim to fully understand how one group of players can make each other worse without trying to do so, but that's what has happened this year, and the coach has to HAS TO adjust.

Really hoping Corbin grows into the role next year. He HAS TO.
Back to top Go down
View user profile
Mutangclan
Hall Of Famer
avatar

Posts : 1296
Points : 1397
Reputation : 73
Join date : 2012-04-26

PostSubject: Re: Change.org Fire Coach T   Thu Apr 11, 2013 2:12 pm

What a great /\ post Troll.

Back to top Go down
View user profile
outerspacefan
Starter
avatar

Posts : 287
Points : 302
Reputation : 15
Join date : 2012-04-26
Location : Outer Space

PostSubject: Re: Change.org Fire Coach T   Thu Apr 11, 2013 2:43 pm

That's it Troll; couldn't have said it better to save my life.
Back to top Go down
View user profile
Mutangclan
Hall Of Famer
avatar

Posts : 1296
Points : 1397
Reputation : 73
Join date : 2012-04-26

PostSubject: Re: Change.org Fire Coach T   Sat Apr 13, 2013 4:47 pm

Wonderful......just effing wonderful.........


Tyrone Corbin will be back next season for the final year of his contract even if the Jazz fail to make the playoffs, according to ESPN.com.
The Jazz are turning in a good season considering they didn't have a legitimate point guard for most of the year. Corbin's inside-out style on offense fits this current team well, but the impending free agency of Paul Millsap and Al Jefferson could be a problem.

Related: Paul Millsap
Source: ESPN.com Apr 13 - 4:41 PM
Back to top Go down
View user profile
outerspacefan
Starter
avatar

Posts : 287
Points : 302
Reputation : 15
Join date : 2012-04-26
Location : Outer Space

PostSubject: Re: Change.org Fire Coach T   Sat Apr 13, 2013 7:05 pm

Mutangclan wrote:
Wonderful......just effing wonderful.........


Tyrone Corbin will be back next season for the final year of his contract even if the Jazz fail to make the playoffs, according to ESPN.com.
The Jazz are turning in a good season considering they didn't have a legitimate point guard for most of the year. Corbin's inside-out style on offense fits this current team well, but the impending free agency of Paul Millsap and Al Jefferson could be a problem.

Related: Paul Millsap
Source: ESPN.com Apr 13 - 4:41 PM

Not something to be mad about; somehow we already knew Jazz would honor the contract. That's Jazz culture. That's why we hate Fisher clown .
Back to top Go down
View user profile
Crunchtime1
Starter


Posts : 339
Points : 395
Reputation : 15
Join date : 2012-04-27

PostSubject: Re: Change.org Fire Coach T   Sun Apr 14, 2013 1:15 pm

Mutangclan wrote:
Wonderful......just effing wonderful.........


Tyrone Corbin will be back next season for the final year of his contract even if the Jazz fail to make the playoffs, according to ESPN.com.

Back to top Go down
View user profile
Saint Louis
Starter


Posts : 382
Points : 473
Reputation : 8
Join date : 2012-04-28

PostSubject: Re: Change.org Fire Coach T   Sun Apr 14, 2013 10:13 pm

Crunchtime1 wrote:
Mutangclan wrote:
Wonderful......just effing wonderful.........


Tyrone Corbin will be back next season for the final year of his contract even if the Jazz fail to make the playoffs, according to ESPN.com.


You know what I hope? I hope the Jazz kick ass next year, with Ty as the coach. That way I can come back on this site and say to all the "Fire Ty" supporters that...

...wait for it...

... wait for it ...

I'm a Jazz fan and I want the Jazz to kick ass!
Back to top Go down
View user profile
thejazzkickazz
6th man


Posts : 126
Points : 158
Reputation : 20
Join date : 2012-04-30

PostSubject: Re: Change.org Fire Coach T   Sun Apr 14, 2013 10:19 pm

I am going to also jump on the anti-anti-Ty bandwagon. His coaching hasn't been perfect this season, but he deserves a full season with a stable team. He's had one half-season, one lockout-shortened season, and a season with 9 free agents. He's had to deal with a lot of injuries and instability. I'm willing to give him one more shot to prove his value to the team.
Back to top Go down
View user profile
The Voice of Reason
Admin
avatar

Posts : 498
Points : 617
Reputation : 21
Join date : 2012-04-26

PostSubject: Re: Change.org Fire Coach T   Sun Apr 14, 2013 10:39 pm

thejazzkickazz wrote:
I am going to also jump on the anti-anti-Ty bandwagon. His coaching hasn't been perfect this season, but he deserves a full season with a stable team. He's had one half-season, one lockout-shortened season, and a season with 9 free agents. He's had to deal with a lot of injuries and instability. I'm willing to give him one more shot to prove his value to the team.

Come on....there is always going to be something to deal with. That's part of the job. How long are we going to make excuses?

Corbin's famous line (after EVERY single loss) "it's just one game" is gonna come back to haunt him as the jazz are possibly gonna miss the playoffs by "just one game".

We take care of business against the Pelicans, the Cavs, and a depleted New York team TWICE and we are not having this conversation. (This is only mentioning the teams we have absolutely no business whatsoever losing to....not even including all the other very winnable games)
Back to top Go down
View user profile
Mutangclan
Hall Of Famer
avatar

Posts : 1296
Points : 1397
Reputation : 73
Join date : 2012-04-26

PostSubject: Re: Change.org Fire Coach T   Mon Apr 15, 2013 7:25 am

The Voice of Reason wrote:
thejazzkickazz wrote:
I am going to also jump on the anti-anti-Ty bandwagon. His coaching hasn't been perfect this season, but he deserves a full season with a stable team. He's had one half-season, one lockout-shortened season, and a season with 9 free agents. He's had to deal with a lot of injuries and instability. I'm willing to give him one more shot to prove his value to the team.

Come on....there is always going to be something to deal with. That's part of the job. How long are we going to make excuses?

Corbin's famous line (after EVERY single loss) "it's just one game" is gonna come back to haunt him as the jazz are possibly gonna miss the playoffs by "just one game".

We take care of business against the Pelicans, the Cavs, and a depleted New York team TWICE and we are not having this conversation. (This is only mentioning the teams we have absolutely no business whatsoever losing to....not even including all the other very winnable games)

eeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeYUP!!

You know what makes it worse, is that the injuries most of the time this season, were the only way that the actual good players played (e.g. Burks FINALLY getting minutes).

Bottom line, is if Corbin played the guys/rotations that me/most of you/desnews writer/trib writers/espn writers/hoopsworld/si.com ALL said to, the Jazz right now would have the 6th seed. Seriously, this isn't Mutangs thing, every single one of those outlets said "what is Corbin doing?".
Back to top Go down
View user profile
The Voice of Reason
Admin
avatar

Posts : 498
Points : 617
Reputation : 21
Join date : 2012-04-26

PostSubject: Re: Change.org Fire Coach T   Mon Apr 15, 2013 8:05 am

Mutangclan wrote:
The Voice of Reason wrote:
thejazzkickazz wrote:
I am going to also jump on the anti-anti-Ty bandwagon. His coaching hasn't been perfect this season, but he deserves a full season with a stable team. He's had one half-season, one lockout-shortened season, and a season with 9 free agents. He's had to deal with a lot of injuries and instability. I'm willing to give him one more shot to prove his value to the team.

Come on....there is always going to be something to deal with. That's part of the job. How long are we going to make excuses?

Corbin's famous line (after EVERY single loss) "it's just one game" is gonna come back to haunt him as the jazz are possibly gonna miss the playoffs by "just one game".

We take care of business against the Pelicans, the Cavs, and a depleted New York team TWICE and we are not having this conversation. (This is only mentioning the teams we have absolutely no business whatsoever losing to....not even including all the other very winnable games)

eeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeYUP!!

You know what makes it worse, is that the injuries most of the time this season, were the only way that the actual good players played (e.g. Burks FINALLY getting minutes).

Bottom line, is if Corbin played the guys/rotations that me/most of you/desnews writer/trib writers/espn writers/hoopsworld/si.com ALL said to, the Jazz right now would have the 6th seed. Seriously, this isn't Mutangs thing, every single one of those outlets said "what is Corbin doing?".

But, but, but....the Jazz employees and local media/talking heads all said that Corbin is doing a great job and that Al is our best player and all kinds of other things that they want us to believe.
Back to top Go down
View user profile
Sponsored content




PostSubject: Re: Change.org Fire Coach T   

Back to top Go down
 
Change.org Fire Coach T
View previous topic View next topic Back to top 
Page 2 of 4Go to page : Previous  1, 2, 3, 4  Next
 Similar topics
-
» Montreal Canadiens fire Coach Guy Carbonneau
» fired coach
» How to fire your coach - David Oliver splits with Brooks Johnson
» FIRE Keith Butler!!!
» Pickering Coach pays Heavy Price

Permissions in this forum:You cannot reply to topics in this forum
Utah Jazz Nation :: The Utah Jazz-
Jump to: