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 The state of the Utah Jazz.

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Mutangclan
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PostSubject: Re: The state of the Utah Jazz.   Sat May 04, 2013 3:39 pm

This one was pretty shocking. Under this article, there are two polls. One, was a do-over of the Deron Williams trade. I was very surprised to see the majority of folks all were still all for the trade. I figured most weren't....figures, smart Jazz fans.

The one that shocked me, but then solidified what have been my thoughts for 2 years now, is this: Which player to you want most to return: DMC, Foye, Al, Paul, Mo, Earl, Jamal. And my man DMC was at the top with 101 out of 345 votes.

Told you all, you're just late to the party!

http://jazzland.blogs.deseretnews.com/2013/05/03/deron-williams-do-over-jody-genessy-weighs-in-on-espn-700-sports-radio/
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PostSubject: Re: The state of the Utah Jazz.   Sat May 04, 2013 3:58 pm

Mutangclan wrote:
This one was pretty shocking. Under this article, there are two polls. One, was a do-over of the Deron Williams trade. I was very surprised to see the majority of folks all were still all for the trade. I figured most weren't....figures, smart Jazz fans.

The one that shocked me, but then solidified what have been my thoughts for 2 years now, is this: Which player to you want most to return: DMC, Foye, Al, Paul, Mo, Earl, Jamal. And my man DMC was at the top with 101 out of 345 votes.

Told you all, you're just late to the party!

http://jazzland.blogs.deseretnews.com/2013/05/03/deron-williams-do-over-jody-genessy-weighs-in-on-espn-700-sports-radio/



Depends on costs? I think we have DMC next year for sure. If we talk about cost from last year i wourl take Foye back.
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PostSubject: Re: The state of the Utah Jazz.   Sat May 04, 2013 7:23 pm

Mutangclan wrote:
This one was pretty shocking. Under this article, there are two polls. One, was a do-over of the Deron Williams trade. I was very surprised to see the majority of folks all were still all for the trade. I figured most weren't....figures, smart Jazz fans.

The one that shocked me, but then solidified what have been my thoughts for 2 years now, is this: Which player to you want most to return: DMC, Foye, Al, Paul, Mo, Earl, Jamal. And my man DMC was at the top with 101 out of 345 votes.

Told you all, you're just late to the party!

http://jazzland.blogs.deseretnews.com/2013/05/03/deron-williams-do-over-jody-genessy-weighs-in-on-espn-700-sports-radio/

Come on now...... many of us (including myself) were just as early to that party and plan on staying all night long. Very Happy
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PostSubject: Re: The state of the Utah Jazz.   Sat May 04, 2013 9:56 pm

zero24gravity wrote:
Mutangclan wrote:
This one was pretty shocking. Under this article, there are two polls. One, was a do-over of the Deron Williams trade. I was very surprised to see the majority of folks all were still all for the trade. I figured most weren't....figures, smart Jazz fans.

The one that shocked me, but then solidified what have been my thoughts for 2 years now, is this: Which player to you want most to return: DMC, Foye, Al, Paul, Mo, Earl, Jamal. And my man DMC was at the top with 101 out of 345 votes.

Told you all, you're just late to the party!

http://jazzland.blogs.deseretnews.com/2013/05/03/deron-williams-do-over-jody-genessy-weighs-in-on-espn-700-sports-radio/

Come on now...... many of us (including myself) were just as early to that party and plan on staying all night long. Very Happy

Yeah, quit acting like you were the only one to notice the DC factor, I was at that party too. Wink Lots of discriminating Jazz fans in this house. Strangely foretelling, I started a thread titled "So why DC"? or something similar after he had been signed on his second 10-day and then carried on the team without seeing a minute of playing time. Then when suddenly he was a factor in the playoffs, it was like, "Oh, that's why!". DC showed last year he deserved more - must have been maddening for him to sit through this season under-appreciated and utilized. Truly, what does the guy have to do other than what he has done to get Coach's attention? I'm going to be surprised if DC re-signs as he is going to get other offers for sure and if I'm him I'm going with the team that promises some playing time, and we have all seen now the Jazz couldn't make minutes for him even when it was glaringly obvious he was needed on the floor. I think some people forget he is still a pup, 24 years old, he has a whole career ahead of him rather than rotting on the bench behind the likes of Marvin Williams.
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PostSubject: Re: The state of the Utah Jazz.   Sun May 05, 2013 9:59 am

Hah, there were tons of folks who didn't see the big deal last year and earlier this season. but I well know there were a handful that did, so it's directed at the still non-believers.

He's not going to get any guarantees to start anywhere either, so thats a benefit to us there. Lets just hope folks are sensible.
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PostSubject: DC Who?   Mon May 06, 2013 7:39 am

Guys,

Outside of Utah no one knows who DC is, which is a good thing for us. I have asked 7-8 fans (they know the game) out here in the south about DC. Not one of them knew who I was talking about. I think that if he wants to play basketball in the NBA, it is going to be for the Utah Jazz. If we want him, he comes back.

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PostSubject: Re: The state of the Utah Jazz.   Mon May 06, 2013 9:46 am

Jazz Dog wrote:
Guys,

Outside of Utah no one knows who DC is, which is a good thing for us. I have asked 7-8 fans (they know the game) out here in the south about DC. Not one of them knew who I was talking about. I think that if he wants to play basketball in the NBA, it is going to be for the Utah Jazz. If we want him, he comes back.


Fans and NBA front offices are totally different animals. I can say with relative certainty that there are zero NBA GM's that don't know who DC is. It's their job to know ALL the options out there when it comes to players.
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PostSubject: Re: The state of the Utah Jazz.   Mon May 06, 2013 10:00 am

MTJazz wrote:
Professo_Sloan wrote:

Well, Ricardo, thing about the NBA is great players tend to be fingered early on. S & M potential was known. This group of three has plenty of talent and can pay fo sho, but they have to defy all odds to be real sick. I see the potential in each, Kanter most, Hayward next, and favors the wild card even though he will be in demand with that skill set, but they aren't all becoming all stars unless God aligns the stars and makes some wishes come true.

Tend to agree here. I think Kanter, GH and Favors are fantastic pieces but they need two more fantastic pieces around them and a complimentary bench before the Jazz ever contend again. Rubber is hitting the road in Jazzland - do they aspire to be cannon fodder for Spurs/OKC every year or do they make moves now that make them relevant again? think about the problems doing this...Sap, Mo and Big Al plus these kids don't look like a future so an improvement means not only the young bucks getting better but getting new talent on board better than Sap, Mo and Big Al. Tall freakin' order!

I really like this young group of kids the Jazz has picked up they might not be any all starts right now but who knows down the road it is way to early to say that none of these guys will make it to that level, I think there are a few that could turnout to be all star caliber types no doubt about it. Looking that this team I think the Jazz has picked up some very good players that are going to be a very strong foundation for the Jazz to build around. Lets face it they have been in the rebuilding mode from the time they first traded DWill but the thing is the Jazz have been able to win while doing so not a lot of teams can do that and that's why I love the Jazz.

The Jazz I think have set themselves up pretty well for this summer's free agency they have a lot of money to spend if they can find the right deals along with being able to do a sign and trade with Milsap and Jefferson like they have done in the past if they don't want to resign one of them. I think the Jazz FO has a plan in place and I have the faith that they will find the kind of players they need to take the next step in becoming a playoff contender for many season's to come.
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PostSubject: Re: The state of the Utah Jazz.   Mon May 06, 2013 10:02 am

zero24gravity wrote:
Jazz Dog wrote:
Guys,

Outside of Utah no one knows who DC is, which is a good thing for us. I have asked 7-8 fans (they know the game) out here in the south about DC. Not one of them knew who I was talking about. I think that if he wants to play basketball in the NBA, it is going to be for the Utah Jazz. If we want him, he comes back.


Fans and NBA front offices are totally different animals. I can say with relative certainty that there are zero NBA GM's that don't know who DC is. It's their job to know ALL the options out there when it comes to players.

Ya, NBA GM's know who he is without a doubt that's what they do for a living if they don't then they are not any good at what they do.
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PostSubject: Re: The state of the Utah Jazz.   Mon May 06, 2013 11:30 am

dongibby wrote:
zero24gravity wrote:
Jazz Dog wrote:
Guys,

Outside of Utah no one knows who DC is, which is a good thing for us. I have asked 7-8 fans (they know the game) out here in the south about DC. Not one of them knew who I was talking about. I think that if he wants to play basketball in the NBA, it is going to be for the Utah Jazz. If we want him, he comes back.


Fans and NBA front offices are totally different animals. I can say with relative certainty that there are zero NBA GM's that don't know who DC is. It's their job to know ALL the options out there when it comes to players.

Ya, NBA GM's know who he is without a doubt that's what they do for a living if they don't then they are not any good at what they do.

Not only should they know who he is, but also every other player in the league and D-league and at least a hundred or so college kids.

That said, they may not know a whole lot more than his numbers and the fact that he's supposed to be some kind of "hustle guy". Not the kind of signing that's very sexy, y'know? Not the kind of signing that builds a Gms' reputation or anything. And all those DNP-CDs!! Must not be VERY good, eh?

You know what surprises me?? How ignorant the sports radio talk show guys are! They'll talk about somebody like he "came out of nowhere" when he's been playing 24-30 min/game for 2 or 3 year! They'll say "Oh, the average fan probably can't name two players off of Team X." when that's absolutely not true! Those guys should be embarrassed, though maybe they're just "big timin' it", only caring about the big stars, because (they say) that's what the average fan does (and it IS how the league promotes itself).
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PostSubject: Re: The state of the Utah Jazz.   Mon May 06, 2013 11:51 am

dongibby wrote:
I think the Jazz FO has a plan in place and I have the faith that they will find the kind of players they need to take the next step in becoming a playoff contender for many season's to come.

Hopefully thats not the plan. Some say thats always been and always will be the Jazz FO plan; to be just good enough to be in the playoffs, and always make money.
I'm hoping (and believe) that Lindsey/KOC have been getting the pieces and will continue this summer to build toward a championship contender.
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PostSubject: Re: The state of the Utah Jazz.   Mon May 06, 2013 1:59 pm

Mutangclan wrote:
dongibby wrote:
I think the Jazz FO has a plan in place and I have the faith that they will find the kind of players they need to take the next step in becoming a playoff contender for many season's to come.

Hopefully thats not the plan. Some say thats always been and always will be the Jazz FO plan; to be just good enough to be in the playoffs, and always make money.
I'm hoping (and believe) that Lindsey/KOC have been getting the pieces and will continue this summer to build toward a championship contender.

Well, Steve Luhm just quoted DL as suggesting that they may keep their powder dry this off-season so maybe this is not the year they actually do much very exciting. Read between those lines and I think they are willing to extend the guys they want, patch it together for next year and then go big the following year. Someone else in another thread had talked about the Jazz real FA agency being next year when the lux tax comes down super hard on other teams. Can't wait to see how both actual Jazz movements and how they spin it to the fans who are ready to be "good now". Its tough to sell a re-building period and despite what a lot of folks think, that is exactly what the Jazz are facing right now. They have some good pieces and apparently a lot of patience and faith.
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PostSubject: Re: The state of the Utah Jazz.   Mon May 06, 2013 2:12 pm

MTJazz wrote:
Mutangclan wrote:
dongibby wrote:
I think the Jazz FO has a plan in place and I have the faith that they will find the kind of players they need to take the next step in becoming a playoff contender for many season's to come.

Hopefully thats not the plan. Some say thats always been and always will be the Jazz FO plan; to be just good enough to be in the playoffs, and always make money.
I'm hoping (and believe) that Lindsey/KOC have been getting the pieces and will continue this summer to build toward a championship contender.

Well, Steve Luhm just quoted DL as suggesting that they may keep their powder dry this off-season so maybe this is not the year they actually do much very exciting. Read between those lines and I think they are willing to extend the guys they want, patch it together for next year and then go big the following year. Someone else in another thread had talked about the Jazz real FA agency being next year when the lux tax comes down super hard on other teams. Can't wait to see how both actual Jazz movements and how they spin it to the fans who are ready to be "good now". Its tough to sell a re-building period and despite what a lot of folks think, that is exactly what the Jazz are facing right now. They have some good pieces and apparently a lot of patience and faith.

That's pretty much it. They are going to resign a few guys and let Favors, Hayward and Kanter take over the team. Like you said after this season, teams are going to be forced to dump a bunch of really good guys, or get killed by the luxury tax. I'm willing to be patient next season, knowing that we will get a much better return on money after the coming season.

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PostSubject: Re: The state of the Utah Jazz.   Mon May 06, 2013 2:19 pm

Romoholic wrote:
MTJazz wrote:
Mutangclan wrote:
dongibby wrote:
I think the Jazz FO has a plan in place and I have the faith that they will find the kind of players they need to take the next step in becoming a playoff contender for many season's to come.

Hopefully thats not the plan. Some say thats always been and always will be the Jazz FO plan; to be just good enough to be in the playoffs, and always make money.
I'm hoping (and believe) that Lindsey/KOC have been getting the pieces and will continue this summer to build toward a championship contender.

Well, Steve Luhm just quoted DL as suggesting that they may keep their powder dry this off-season so maybe this is not the year they actually do much very exciting. Read between those lines and I think they are willing to extend the guys they want, patch it together for next year and then go big the following year. Someone else in another thread had talked about the Jazz real FA agency being next year when the lux tax comes down super hard on other teams. Can't wait to see how both actual Jazz movements and how they spin it to the fans who are ready to be "good now". Its tough to sell a re-building period and despite what a lot of folks think, that is exactly what the Jazz are facing right now. They have some good pieces and apparently a lot of patience and faith.

That's pretty much it. They are going to resign a few guys and let Favors, Hayward and Kanter take over the team. Like you said after this season, teams are going to be forced to dump a bunch of really good guys, or get killed by the luxury tax. I'm willing to be patient next season, knowing that we will get a much better return on money after the coming season.

Yeah, we are the more patient type but I wonder how they are going to sell this strategy to the ticket buyers. Plus, by the time the season is rolling it is so easy to be dissapointed with the product, like this year. I'd actually be more psyched about seeing a young re-building team with modest expectations than this year's flawed edition.
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PostSubject: Re: The state of the Utah Jazz.   Mon May 06, 2013 3:37 pm

MTJazz wrote:
Romoholic wrote:
MTJazz wrote:
Mutangclan wrote:
dongibby wrote:
I think the Jazz FO has a plan in place and I have the faith that they will find the kind of players they need to take the next step in becoming a playoff contender for many season's to come.

Hopefully thats not the plan. Some say thats always been and always will be the Jazz FO plan; to be just good enough to be in the playoffs, and always make money.
I'm hoping (and believe) that Lindsey/KOC have been getting the pieces and will continue this summer to build toward a championship contender.

Well, Steve Luhm just quoted DL as suggesting that they may keep their powder dry this off-season so maybe this is not the year they actually do much very exciting. Read between those lines and I think they are willing to extend the guys they want, patch it together for next year and then go big the following year. Someone else in another thread had talked about the Jazz real FA agency being next year when the lux tax comes down super hard on other teams. Can't wait to see how both actual Jazz movements and how they spin it to the fans who are ready to be "good now". Its tough to sell a re-building period and despite what a lot of folks think, that is exactly what the Jazz are facing right now. They have some good pieces and apparently a lot of patience and faith.

That's pretty much it. They are going to resign a few guys and let Favors, Hayward and Kanter take over the team. Like you said after this season, teams are going to be forced to dump a bunch of really good guys, or get killed by the luxury tax. I'm willing to be patient next season, knowing that we will get a much better return on money after the coming season.

Yeah, we are the more patient type but I wonder how they are going to sell this strategy to the ticket buyers. Plus, by the time the season is rolling it is so easy to be dissapointed with the product, like this year. I'd actually be more psyched about seeing a young re-building team with modest expectations than this year's flawed edition.

That's the thing though. I think most Jazz fans can handle rebuilding, if the Jazz front office Doesn't try to hand out false expectations. I mean I guess we as Jazz fans were a little naive last off season about the prospects for this season. We saw them address the shooting problems with guys like Foye and trade for Marvin as well as bring in Mo. We should have seen though that we had the majority of the team expiring after the season, That's a recipe for disaster, and flat out shows that they are gearing up for a future move, and this was a transition season.

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PostSubject: Re: The state of the Utah Jazz.   Mon May 06, 2013 3:56 pm

Romoholic wrote:


That's the thing though. I think most Jazz fans can handle rebuilding, if the Jazz front office Doesn't try to hand out false expectations. I mean I guess we as Jazz fans were a little naive last off season about the prospects for this season. We saw them address the shooting problems with guys like Foye and trade for Marvin as well as bring in Mo. We should have seen though that we had the majority of the team expiring after the season, That's a recipe for disaster, and flat out shows that they are gearing up for a future move, and this was a transition season.

At the end of the day they definitely are smarter than us and basically playing chess on three levels while we are still trying to master the lowest. I think this year they must have felt pretty smart in a lot of ways even though it didn't roll all their way. The "patching the holes" approach with short-term contracts could have led to a playoff berth PLUS they would be sitting...exactly where they are now. Not a bad bid on their part. What they probably didn't expect was that Ty was going to have such a tough year managing all the young talent and the established egos, (which by all reports he did well), and he showed lots to be desired as a game tactician, where he clearly was not in the same league as the opposing coaches most nights. An argument can be made that the gamble they appear to be all in on - have major bank to spend and solid pieces when the the procrastinating teams are dumping really good talent next July, (with glimmers to come during the pre-Feb season which should be active compared to this year) - isn't actually the way to go. An argument could be made to go after a top tier FA or veteran via trade now or last year to start building team cohesiveness. But, I'm sure the FO would say there just wasn't a good trade/acquisition to be made, so don't blow up the cap room trying to please impatient fans. Who knows, none of this is that easy or predictable. We all do know that history is very much against going consistently deep in the playoffs without a star or two on board. One can hold up the Pistons of yesteryear model but that was what, one team in the last two decades at least? And as we saw, the deepest "starless" team in the league, the Nuggies, went out in the first round in part because one seriously key guy went down with injury. And what to make of Golden State? They have no business being in the second round, but there they are. What model is that? Sure, they tanked, but it wasn't Barnes doing a Timmy D on a stacked SA team - it was actually assembling a surprisingly potent line-up made up of one almost star and a team that believes in itself. Not that they are going any deeper, nor will they necessarily even make the playoffs next year with a re-tooled Mavs, an improved HOU, (look out, they are going to go for it), and a likely better Blazers. End of Monday rambling speculations....
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PostSubject: Re: The state of the Utah Jazz.   Tue May 07, 2013 12:51 am

MTJazz wrote:
Romoholic wrote:


That's the thing though. I think most Jazz fans can handle rebuilding, if the Jazz front office Doesn't try to hand out false expectations. I mean I guess we as Jazz fans were a little naive last off season about the prospects for this season. We saw them address the shooting problems with guys like Foye and trade for Marvin as well as bring in Mo. We should have seen though that we had the majority of the team expiring after the season, That's a recipe for disaster, and flat out shows that they are gearing up for a future move, and this was a transition season.

At the end of the day they definitely are smarter than us and basically playing chess on three levels while we are still trying to master the lowest. I think this year they must have felt pretty smart in a lot of ways even though it didn't roll all their way. The "patching the holes" approach with short-term contracts could have led to a playoff berth PLUS they would be sitting...exactly where they are now. Not a bad bid on their part. What they probably didn't expect was that Ty was going to have such a tough year managing all the young talent and the established egos, (which by all reports he did well), and he showed lots to be desired as a game tactician, where he clearly was not in the same league as the opposing coaches most nights. An argument can be made that the gamble they appear to be all in on - have major bank to spend and solid pieces when the the procrastinating teams are dumping really good talent next July, (with glimmers to come during the pre-Feb season which should be active compared to this year) - isn't actually the way to go. An argument could be made to go after a top tier FA or veteran via trade now or last year to start building team cohesiveness. But, I'm sure the FO would say there just wasn't a good trade/acquisition to be made, so don't blow up the cap room trying to please impatient fans. Who knows, none of this is that easy or predictable. We all do know that history is very much against going consistently deep in the playoffs without a star or two on board. One can hold up the Pistons of yesteryear model but that was what, one team in the last two decades at least? And as we saw, the deepest "starless" team in the league, the Nuggies, went out in the first round in part because one seriously key guy went down with injury. And what to make of Golden State? They have no business being in the second round, but there they are. What model is that? Sure, they tanked, but it wasn't Barnes doing a Timmy D on a stacked SA team - it was actually assembling a surprisingly potent line-up made up of one almost star and a team that believes in itself. Not that they are going any deeper, nor will they necessarily even make the playoffs next year with a re-tooled Mavs, an improved HOU, (look out, they are going to go for it), and a likely better Blazers. End of Monday rambling speculations....

Wow, this thread is making me secretly proud I am a Jazz fan! And, since I'm in St. Louis, I don't even have to be secretive about it (because many people here don't even know Utah has an NBA team) (Since St. Louis doesn't have an NBA team, the entire NBA is somewhat neglected to page 4 or 5 while the Blues, Cardinals, and Rams dominate the first 3 pages of the Sports section). Lots of great posts on this thread.

And, the fact we didn't make the playoffs this year is completely behind me as a Jazz fan. We've got great young players and lots of money for our team in a system that is mildly cracking down on teams that could spend their way into contention (LA's 2 teams, NY's 2 tms, and other big market city teams). I'm really hoping the luxury tax will do what the league says it is designed for (leveling the playing field). It's too early to tell, but, I think we have more of a "controlled" free market chance.

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PostSubject: Re: The state of the Utah Jazz.   Tue May 07, 2013 9:10 am

While I have pushed for the idea of finding a way to bring in someone like T.Evans, I can see another way to run this thing. The only way the Jazz will truly know what they have in the "core 4" is if they give them major burn. If they let the young guns play big minutes this upcoming year, then the team will actually know what they have & can build the team around that NEXT summer. For example, if Kanter blows up into a 20 PPG, effiient, All Star calibur player in 2013-14, then they know they don't need to find a go-to post scorer. If Burks turns out to be an amazing 15/8 PG that can run the team, then the Jazz FO no longer needs make a run at a point man. On the flip side, if Favors regresses & looks like he can't handle a 30+ minute workload, then they know that they may need to look into bringing in another defensive minded big. If one or more of these guys bursts out into a "star" role, then the team may only need to worry about finding complimentary pieces & save their money for resignings, but if these young guys seem like nothing more than decent complimentary players, then the team will need to pursue a "star" for the 2014-15 season.

So as much as the 2013-14 season could be about developing, it'll also give the team knowledge about what they actually need moving forward. Right now, they probably have very little idea what they need as a team because the "core 4" haven't (outside of Gordon) had a real chance to play. A year of seeing what they can do will give them a much better idea about what to do with the future, where-as if the team signs a bunch of guys (like last season) that will cut into the young guy's PT, then the team may be heading into 2014-15 with no more idea about what these guys can truly do than they know right now..... it'd be a wasted year.
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PostSubject: Re: The state of the Utah Jazz.   Tue May 07, 2013 5:32 pm

Watched the first game of the OKC/MEM series?
Do we really think Hayward or Favors will ever be able to sustain that kind of in game pressure all night long? I don't think so.

This group so called "core four" didn't really showed they can take it and be the foundation for a perennial playoff team, let away contender team.

As some fellow posters have said, they can be the sidekicks, the solid role guys. Kanter's the one of them that probably "has it", and Burks has the attitude... but it's still a long shot for them to become centerpieces of deep playoff runs.

As Lindsey already told us, patience is the name of the game now. So just get as comfortable as you can and enjoy the re-rebuilding game. I know I will Basketball


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PostSubject: Re: The state of the Utah Jazz.   Thu May 09, 2013 11:22 am

There is one player that I would like to see the Jazz try to trade for and I think there's a good chance to get him without giving up the farm Danny Granger, I know that he has been injured but because of that and the way Paul George played last season the Pacers are willing to deal him. I think he still can play at an all-star level and if the Jazz could make a good enough deal it could turnout to be a big time move for them. The SF position is one of the Jazz biggest needs and I think Granger could be the best fit at that position the Jazz could get something to think about.
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PostSubject: Re: The state of the Utah Jazz.   Thu May 09, 2013 11:52 am

dongibby wrote:
There is one player that I would like to see the Jazz try to trade for and I think there's a good chance to get him without giving up the farm Danny Granger, I know that he has been injured but because of that and the way Paul George played last season the Pacers are willing to deal him. I think he still can play at an all-star level and if the Jazz could make a good enough deal it could turnout to be a big time move for them. The SF position is one of the Jazz biggest needs and I think Granger could be the best fit at that position the Jazz could get something to think about.


Ooooo ... that's someone I hadn't even considered.

One thing that worries me is that his FG% has declined each of the past 5 years & is probably best suited to be a 2nd option on offense even though he's a proven 20 PPG scorer. He does have a good all-around game. If he proves to be healthy & comes cheap, I would not be opposed. He comes with a hefty price tag ($13million) and will be in the last year of his contract. The $ isn't that big of a deal if they can't land a big(ish) name FA, but he could turn out to be a 1 year rent-a-player if he doens't want to resign in Utah. With all that in mind, I'm not sure what I would be willing to give up for him if I'm the Jazz FO.

Still like Tyreke Evans more, but I think you have a good point about Granger being available & filling a need for the team.
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PostSubject: Re: The state of the Utah Jazz.   Thu May 09, 2013 7:15 pm

zero24gravity wrote:
While I have pushed for the idea of finding a way to bring in someone like T.Evans, I can see another way to run this thing. The only way the Jazz will truly know what they have in the "core 4" is if they give them major burn. If they let the young guns play big minutes this upcoming year, then the team will actually know what they have & can build the team around that NEXT summer. For example, if Kanter blows up into a 20 PPG, effiient, All Star calibur player in 2013-14, then they know they don't need to find a go-to post scorer. If Burks turns out to be an amazing 15/8 PG that can run the team, then the Jazz FO no longer needs make a run at a point man. On the flip side, if Favors regresses & looks like he can't handle a 30+ minute workload, then they know that they may need to look into bringing in another defensive minded big. If one or more of these guys bursts out into a "star" role, then the team may only need to worry about finding complimentary pieces & save their money for resignings, but if these young guys seem like nothing more than decent complimentary players, then the team will need to pursue a "star" for the 2014-15 season.

So as much as the 2013-14 season could be about developing, it'll also give the team knowledge about what they actually need moving forward. Right now, they probably have very little idea what they need as a team because the "core 4" haven't (outside of Gordon) had a real chance to play. A year of seeing what they can do will give them a much better idea about what to do with the future, where-as if the team signs a bunch of guys (like last season) that will cut into the young guy's PT, then the team may be heading into 2014-15 with no more idea about what these guys can truly do than they know right now..... it'd be a wasted year.

I expect that is exactly what the Jazz FO is going to do - keep the powder dry, see what the young guys are all about. Unless, of course, something too good to be true falls in their lap. Actually, I'm guessing that no one is looking at Burks as a potential starting PG, so plugging that hole could be pretty high on the list. We all need to be prepared for the lottery again next year but no problem for me as long as the plan is obvious. I will gouge my eyes out if they bring in a bunch of "respected veterans" on one and two year contracts that Ty will then feel obliged to play. I say roll the damn dice all over the table, bring in a bunch of prospects and overlooked players with upside, use the entire season as a tryout for '14-15, the year the Jazz's patient plotting pays off.
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PostSubject: Re: The state of the Utah Jazz.   Thu May 09, 2013 8:04 pm

MTJazz wrote:
zero24gravity wrote:
While I have pushed for the idea of finding a way to bring in someone like T.Evans, I can see another way to run this thing. The only way the Jazz will truly know what they have in the "core 4" is if they give them major burn. If they let the young guns play big minutes this upcoming year, then the team will actually know what they have & can build the team around that NEXT summer. For example, if Kanter blows up into a 20 PPG, effiient, All Star calibur player in 2013-14, then they know they don't need to find a go-to post scorer. If Burks turns out to be an amazing 15/8 PG that can run the team, then the Jazz FO no longer needs make a run at a point man. On the flip side, if Favors regresses & looks like he can't handle a 30+ minute workload, then they know that they may need to look into bringing in another defensive minded big. If one or more of these guys bursts out into a "star" role, then the team may only need to worry about finding complimentary pieces & save their money for resignings, but if these young guys seem like nothing more than decent complimentary players, then the team will need to pursue a "star" for the 2014-15 season.

So as much as the 2013-14 season could be about developing, it'll also give the team knowledge about what they actually need moving forward. Right now, they probably have very little idea what they need as a team because the "core 4" haven't (outside of Gordon) had a real chance to play. A year of seeing what they can do will give them a much better idea about what to do with the future, where-as if the team signs a bunch of guys (like last season) that will cut into the young guy's PT, then the team may be heading into 2014-15 with no more idea about what these guys can truly do than they know right now..... it'd be a wasted year.

I expect that is exactly what the Jazz FO is going to do - keep the powder dry, see what the young guys are all about. Unless, of course, something too good to be true falls in their lap. Actually, I'm guessing that no one is looking at Burks as a potential starting PG, so plugging that hole could be pretty high on the list. We all need to be prepared for the lottery again next year but no problem for me as long as the plan is obvious. I will gouge my eyes out if they bring in a bunch of "respected veterans" on one and two year contracts that Ty will then feel obliged to play. I say roll the damn dice all over the table, bring in a bunch of prospects and overlooked players with upside, use the entire season as a tryout for '14-15, the year the Jazz's patient plotting pays off.

I'm definitely leaning in this direction, too. I hope the team doesn't resign any of the veteran guys, unless it's a sign-and-trade. Rather, keep the core five, with Kevin Murphy, and the two draft picks, and Marv. That's nine guys, right there. Then fill out the roster with some good position/roll players who are willing to take cheap, short term contracts. As you have said, this will send a loud and clear message from the FO to Coach Ty that he has the green light to play the young guns and not worry so much about winning. We will then finally see what these young guys are made of and can ascertain whether the Jazz will have enough firepower going forward to contend, or whether its time to blow it up again and start over.

Plus, sign Jason Collins, just for fun.
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PostSubject: Re: The state of the Utah Jazz.   Thu May 09, 2013 10:26 pm

[quote="thejazzkickazz"]
MTJazz wrote:
zero24gravity wrote:
While I have pushed for the idea of finding a way to bring in someone like T.Evans, I can see another way to run this thing. The only way the Jazz will truly know what they have in the "core 4" is if they give them major burn. If they let the young guns play big minutes this upcoming year, then the team will actually know what they have & can build the team around that NEXT summer. For example, if Kanter blows up into a 20 PPG, effiient, All Star calibur player in 2013-14, then they know they don't need to find a go-to post scorer. If Burks turns out to be an amazing 15/8 PG that can run the team, then the Jazz FO no longer needs make a run at a point man. On the flip side, if Favors regresses & looks like he can't handle a 30+ minute workload, then they know that they may need to look into bringing in another defensive minded big. If one or more of these guys bursts out into a "star" role, then the team may only need to worry about finding complimentary pieces & save their money for resignings, but if these young guys seem like nothing more than decent complimentary players, then the team will need to pursue a "star" for the 2014-15 season.

So as much as the 2013-14 season could be about developing, it'll also give the team knowledge about what they actually need moving forward. Right now, they probably have very little idea what they need as a team because the "core 4" haven't (outside of Gordon) had a real chance to play. A year of seeing what they can do will give them a much better idea about what to do with the future, where-as if the team signs a bunch of guys (like last season) that will cut into the young guy's PT, then the team may be heading into 2014-15 with no more idea about what these guys can truly do than they know right now..... it'd be a wasted year.

I expect that is exactly what the Jazz FO is going to do - keep the powder dry, see what the young guys are all about. Unless, of course, something too good to be true falls in their lap. Actually, I'm guessing that no one is looking at Burks as a potential starting PG, so plugging that hole could be pretty high on the list. We all need to be prepared for the lottery again next year but no problem for me as long as the plan is obvious. I will gouge my eyes out if they bring in a bunch of "respected veterans" on one and two year contracts that Ty will then feel obliged to play. I say roll the damn dice all over the table, bring in a bunch of prospects and overlooked players with upside, use the entire season as a tryout for '14-15, the year the Jazz's patient plotting pays off.

I'm definitely leaning in this direction, too. I hope the team doesn't resign any of the veteran guys, unless it's a sign-and-trade. Rather, keep the core five, with Kevin Murphy, and the two draft picks, and Marv. That's nine guys, right there. Then fill out the roster with some good position/roll players who are willing to take cheap, short term contracts. As you have said, this will send a loud and clear message from the FO to Coach Ty that he has the green light to play the young guns and not worry so much about winning. We will then finally see what these young guys are made of and can ascertain whether the Jazz will have enough firepower going forward to contend, or whether its time to blow it up again and start over.

Plus, sign Jason Collins, just for fun.[/quote]

That would go over like a turd in the punch bowl here. Twisted Evil

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PostSubject: Re: The state of the Utah Jazz.   Fri May 10, 2013 3:15 am

dongibby wrote:
There is one player that I would like to see the Jazz try to trade for and I think there's a good chance to get him without giving up the farm Danny Granger, I know that he has been injured but because of that and the way Paul George played last season the Pacers are willing to deal him. I think he still can play at an all-star level and if the Jazz could make a good enough deal it could turnout to be a big time move for them. The SF position is one of the Jazz biggest needs and I think Granger could be the best fit at that position the Jazz could get something to think about.

I like Danny Granger as a Grant Hill-like addition to any team. If the money were right, bring him on board. I have a better idea, though. Talk to CP3. Get a feel for what it would take to bring him here. We may have a few pieces he already likes. I don't think maximizing the money they can make is always a player's prime motive when they can make their own decisions. CP3 has never really been given a chance to determine where he plays-- he was drafted to one team, almost traded to another (which the league vetoed), then traded. CP3 controls the next move-- maybe he'll want to play for the team that produced the all-time assist leader and stealer in NBA history. Give him a say as to who he wants to play with, and use our cap space to provide it!
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